Can't format numbering when I apply styles

[namedujour]

This appears to be a bug, but I need a work-around, if someone has any ideas!!

I have to apply a style to everything in my documents because I import them
into a softward that converts them into online help (Flare). Flare formats
all the text on the basis of the styles I apply in Word. If I don't create
styles, I have to format everything twice, or it displays incorrectly in the
online help.

I created a style called NumberedList, which obviously is a numbered list. I
have the indentation, the paragraph settings and the tabs all defined.
Everything is saved to Normal.dot.

When I apply the style, the numbering doesn't work. I have checked and
rechecked the settings in the style. Styles work with everything except
bullets and numbering. The bullets are unpredictable and keep whipping back
and forth between formatting settings - paragraph indents and the like (no,
they are not set to automatically update!), but I can manage them.

I cannot manage numbered styles. They simply do not work.

First of all, Word insists on continuing lists instead of restarting the
numbering with "1" even though I manually customized the numbering sequence
to start at 1 (after selecting "Restart Numbering" a dozen times and seeing
that it didn't work), and the little Bullets and Numbering>Customize>Start At
box clearly says "1" when I check and recheck and check again.

Then, it keeps setting the wrong paragraph indent. It's all over the place
in the document, but never the RIGHT place.

The style is based on Normal style because I have to do that in order for
things to set up correctly in Flare. But it doesn't matter - when I base it
on other styles it still doesn't work.

What I've done:

* Turned numbering off and on again. Typically it will switch from, say, 4
to NO numbering, to 2, and back again each time I click the icon. The
paragraph indent is all over the place as well.
* Deleted the style and created it again.
* Modified the style by applying Automatically Update, and manually applying
settings.
* Modified the style without Automatically Update and manually applying
settings.
*Applied the style and manually fixed the formatting - but I can't fix the
numbering sequence.
* Used the paintbrush tool to paste formatting from other areas of the
document.
* Gone into Bullets and Numbering to manually click Restart Numbering. It's
always either pre-selected, or grayed out.

Word does not permit me to set "Restart Numbering" as the default when I'm
creating or modifying a style - those fields don't even exist in that
function. I'm at the mercy of manual formatting - which Word doesn't let me
do - or leaving the text without a style, which will bite me when I shift
over to Flare.

Someone please help!

 

[namedujour]

I forgot to say I'm using Word 2003.

This appears to be a bug, but I need a work-around, if someone has any ideas!!

I have to apply a style to everything in my documents because I import them
into a softward that converts them into online help (Flare). Flare formats
all the text on the basis of the styles I apply in Word. If I don't create
styles, I have to format everything twice, or it displays incorrectly in the
online help.

I created a style called NumberedList, which obviously is a numbered list. I
have the indentation, the paragraph settings and the tabs all defined.
Everything is saved to Normal.dot.

When I apply the style, the numbering doesn't work. I have checked and
rechecked the settings in the style. Styles work with everything except
bullets and numbering. The bullets are unpredictable and keep whipping back
and forth between formatting settings - paragraph indents and the like (no,
they are not set to automatically update!), but I can manage them.

I cannot manage numbered styles. They simply do not work.

First of all, Word insists on continuing lists instead of restarting the
numbering with "1" even though I manually customized the numbering sequence
to start at 1 (after selecting "Restart Numbering" a dozen times and seeing
that it didn't work), and the little Bullets and Numbering>Customize>Start At
box clearly says "1" when I check and recheck and check again.

Then, it keeps setting the wrong paragraph indent. It's all over the place
in the document, but never the RIGHT place.

The style is based on Normal style because I have to do that in order for
things to set up correctly in Flare. But it doesn't matter - when I base it
on other styles it still doesn't work.

What I've done:

* Turned numbering off and on again. Typically it will switch from, say, 4
to NO numbering, to 2, and back again each time I click the icon. The
paragraph indent is all over the place as well.
* Deleted the style and created it again.
* Modified the style by applying Automatically Update, and manually applying
settings.
* Modified the style without Automatically Update and manually applying
settings.
*Applied the style and manually fixed the formatting - but I can't fix the
numbering sequence.
* Used the paintbrush tool to paste formatting from other areas of the
document.
* Gone into Bullets and Numbering to manually click Restart Numbering. It's
always either pre-selected, or grayed out.

Word does not permit me to set "Restart Numbering" as the default when I'm
creating or modifying a style - those fields don't even exist in that
function. I'm at the mercy of manual formatting - which Word doesn't let me
do - or leaving the text without a style, which will bite me when I shift
over to Flare.

Someone please help!

 

[namedujour]

I figured it out. It's clumsy and kind of stupid, and I really wish it was
intuitive. However, it works. I inserted a section break in front of each new
numbered list, then clicked Restart Numbering again. The section break
evidently makes the list not see - and continue - the previous list. Then the
styled text also for whatever the reason, seems to obey the style's
formatting settings. (For now anyway. It could all change on me in a minute.)

 

[namedujour]

Okay. Section breaks only work intermittently. And they're totally
impractical when you're working in tables, as I am.

And I took the time to create a whole new document in case the old one was
corrupt. (It wasn't.)

Here's the fix, should anyone else encounter this: Create alternate
numbering styles. Call one NumberedList and call the other one
NumberedListToo. Leap frog them so you don't have a recurring sequence of the
same numbered style. The formatting may not totally obey, but at least you
can reset the numbering!

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

See http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/OutlineNumbering.html and
http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/Numbering/ListRestartMethods.htm. Also, Word has a
built-in series of numbered styles (List Number, List Number 2, etc.) that
would give you a head start.

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

I wonder if you have read www.shaunakelly.com/word

It sounds as though you may not fully understand the concept of List
Templates and how to associate these with styles. There's nothing
"intuitive" about it It's an extremely complex mechanism, and you
either know it, or you don't

Basically, a "Style" is a named collection of formatting. There can be
multiple types of styles in a document, of which the "Paragraph" type can
have a Numbering format. The others can not. The first thing to check is
that the styles you are dealing with are actually paragraph styles, not
character styles.

I always strongly suggest to people that they use the Word built-in styles
rather than creating their own, because the built-in ones are
fully-configured with all of the properties set to work with all of the
dependencies inherent in an object-oriented environment.

In your case, I would recommend using the built-in styles List Number
through List Number 9.

A paragraph style can have a List Template associated with it. A list
template defines all of the characteristics of a bulleted or numbered list
(same thing, internally).

A "List" is a collection of paragraphs. They do not need to be adjacent,
but they must be consecutive. In other words, there can be "other"
paragraphs mixed up with the list, but the numbering depends on the serial
position within the document of each paragraph that is a member of the list.

A list of paragraphs can have a list template associated with it, or it can
have a style applied to it. If a style is applied to the list, and the
style has a list template defined as a property of it, that list template
will be applied to the member paragraphs of the list.

Regrettably, users who do not understand the mechanism can apply BOTH a list
template and a style with numbering to the same list of paragraphs. In that
circumstance, the results become close to "undefined" and you get the
condition you have observed.

Now, there can be more than 200 list templates in a document, but a single
list template can apply to only ONE list of paragraphs. So members of that
list can be anywhere within the document, but any paragraphs that have that
list template are all members of the same list.

On the other hand, you can have a large number of lists in a document, each
with an independent list template defining its numbering format.

I prefer the first way of working: I define a "set" of styles for my
numbering, and associate a single list template with each set. This means
my numbering is consistent and stable throughout the document.

If you have multiple lists formatted with a single list template, you need
to find a way to persuade the first paragraph in each list to restart at
"1". This can be done in a variety of ways: I prefer to right-click the
first number and choose "Restart at 1". Each method has multiple complex
considerations.

See here:
http://word.mvps.org/faqs/numbering/ListRestartMethods.htm

Whichever way you choose, make sure you do not apply the wrong list template
to some of the members of a particular list. If you do that, your day
becomes even more interesting than it currently is.

Hope this helps

I figured it out. It's clumsy and kind of stupid, and I really wish it was
intuitive. However, it works. I inserted a section break in front of each new
numbered list, then clicked Restart Numbering again. The section break
evidently makes the list not see - and continue - the previous list. Then the
styled text also for whatever the reason, seems to obey the style's
formatting settings. (For now anyway. It could all change on me in a minute.)

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410