Crash when copying and pasting tasks from linked project file.

[&e7]

I'm trying to copy and paste tasks from a linked project file into the master
file.
Practically every time I try to paste the copied selection Project crashes.

There are some instances where I can copy tasks. I don't have a particularly
complex setup here as I'm just trying to set up a system where multiple
project managers can work on the same project by each having their own linked
files.

Of course, unless I can find a way of copying tasks from their backlog files
into the current iteration the whole thing will grind to a sad end.

Anyone know any solutions?

Please don't say 'Project Server' to me though

 

[&e7]

Oh and yes, I have SP2

 

[John]

Oh and yes, I have SP2

&e7,
Since you mention the SP2 update I assume you have Project 2003. Correct?

You mention that you have a linked project file and a master file and
that you want to cut and paste. On the surface that scenario doesn't
make a whole lot of sense. What is the file linked to? What makes up the
master file?

It sounds like you are trying to create a configuration wherein more
than one user can access a file with read/write capability
simultaneously. Sorry, that can't happen. And even if you could
replicate the file, with all the links, you are asking for some very
significant problems (i.e. corruption).

If you can more succinctly explain your configuration and your end goal,
then maybe we can offer some suggestions.

John
Project MVP

 

[John]

Oh and yes, I have SP2

&e7,
I replied yesterday but don't see that reply so I'll try again. Pardon
me if this is redundant.

You mention having SP2 but you don't say which version of Project. I'm
not sure it matters but it is always good information to supply when
posting.

I'm confused about what you actually have with regard to configuration.
You say you have a linked file. What is is linked to? What is the master
made up of (i.e. does it include the noted file or something else)? What
exactly are you trying to copy and paste?

If you are trying to set up a configuration wherein more than one user
has simultaneous read/write access to a file, that can't happen. And as
far as copying files with links, you are asking for trouble (i.e.
corruption).

If you can give us a more succinct description of your configuration and
your end goal, then we can help. And, the answer may or may not be
Project Server.

John
Project MVP

 

[&e7]

Firstly, I'm using Project 2007

I have a 'master' project file which contains my milestone tasks and
assorted other tasks.
It also includes a number of linked project files (click insert | project,
tick the 'linked' box). These project files are intended to be owned by the
departments contributing to the project as a whole and will contain the
backlog (the list of remaining work not yet committed to the current
milestone) for each department. I can allow them to edit their own backlog
files to add detail, notes etc without having to fight over a single huge
Project file.

My aim is to meet regularly with the department heads and commit work from
the backlog into a milestone rollup in the parent document that is published
to the team (approx 100 people!). The obvious solution to this is to copy the
tasks that we want to achieve from the backlogs into a roll-up in the master
project file.

Essentially, cutting and pasting tasks from one place in the schedule to
another is what I'm doing. The only 'different' thing I'm doing here is
cutting tasks from an area of the project file that's actiually contained in
an external file. Sometimes it works, sometimes it crashes. I'd have expected
that if you were to be able to include nested project files, that you'd be
able to work with them in the same way as all the rest of the tasks in the
file. Working with linked project files is well documented in the MSProject
help files.

Does that help?

Andy

 

[Rob Schneider]

Firstly, I'm using Project 2007

I have a 'master' project file which contains my milestone tasks and
assorted other tasks.
It also includes a number of linked project files (click insert | project,
tick the 'linked' box). These project files are intended to be owned by the
departments contributing to the project as a whole and will contain the
backlog (the list of remaining work not yet committed to the current
milestone) for each department. I can allow them to edit their own backlog
files to add detail, notes etc without having to fight over a single huge
Project file.

My aim is to meet regularly with the department heads and commit work from
the backlog into a milestone rollup in the parent document that is published
to the team (approx 100 people!). The obvious solution to this is to copy the
tasks that we want to achieve from the backlogs into a roll-up in the master
project file.

Essentially, cutting and pasting tasks from one place in the schedule to
another is what I'm doing. The only 'different' thing I'm doing here is
cutting tasks from an area of the project file that's actiually contained in
an external file. Sometimes it works, sometimes it crashes. I'd have expected
that if you were to be able to include nested project files, that you'd be
able to work with them in the same way as all the rest of the tasks in the
file. Working with linked project files is well documented in the MSProject
help files.

Does that help?

Andy

If I get you right, you are inserting only parts of project files, e.g.
individual tasks ... not the full mpp file?

My experience is that inserting/link full mpp files works well and has
for years. However, inserting individual bits of files requires too
much power from the operating system (OLE) and is fraught with risk. I
don't ever do.

Maybe instead of inserting parts of files, you insert full files and
then use filtering to hide what you don't want to ssee.

 

[&e7]

I'm inserting full mpp files that just contain the work for each department
(didn't know you could insert sections - and yes, sounds scary).

My problem is cutting and pasting tasks between the inserted file and the
main one that contains it.

 

[Rob Schneider]

I'm inserting full mpp files that just contain the work for each department
(didn't know you could insert sections - and yes, sounds scary).

My problem is cutting and pasting tasks between the inserted file and the
main one that contains it.

Can you explain exactly what you are doing.

I would use: Menu: Insert/Project, click on "link to project" check
box, select the file, then press Insert button. I would never cut and
paste. Explain again why you are cutting and why you are pasting?

 

[John]

I'm inserting full mpp files that just contain the work for each department
(didn't know you could insert sections - and yes, sounds scary).

My problem is cutting and pasting tasks between the inserted file and the
main one that contains it.

Andy,
I think you misunderstood Rob's reply. With Project a user can NOT
insert parts of a file into a master file - it's all or nothing. Don't
confuse "insert" with cut and paste. In Project "insert" has a special
meaning. It is the process of placing a pointer to one file (the whole
file) into another - that's how Project creates dynamic master files.

I'm still having trouble understanding why you insert the subproject
files into the master and then also want to cut and paste. The two seem
totally redundant. If you were just creating a dynamic master (i.e.
linked subprojects), OR cutting and pasting selected tasks from the
subprojects into another file (pseudo master), then it might make some
sense. Like Rob, I recommend the former, (i.e. linked master), since it
keeps everything tied together dynamically. Creating a pseudo master by
cutting and pasting creates a whole lot of manual maintenance overhead
and more chance for human error. But don't try to do both, (i.e. insert
and cut/paste), as I said in my initial response(s), you are just asking
for tons of trouble.

John
Project MVP

 

[&e7]

Sorry, I thought I'd explained it pretty clearly. Here's more info...

This is a large games project, so we have producers responsible for art,
code, animation, audio etc. Each of these guys is making a schedule of all
their team's work to the end of the project. They each have a seperate MPP
for their team's work. One for the art, one for the animations etc. The tasks
in each file run into the hundreds and even thousands.

I've got all these seperate MPP files inserted into a master file, so that I
can level everything and make sure that their work won't overrun key
milestone dates. This allows the producers to update their own MPPs without
having to worry about the contention that would arise if EVERYTHING was in
one giant MPP.

Each month, I want to move tasks, selected from their mpp files into one
place so that the ENTIRE team can see what they need to be working on for
that month. Having all the tasks for a month's milestone in one place makes
it easier for the team to work out the intricate dependencies that exist
between the work.
If I expand one of the inserted files, click on a task and drag it into the
parent MPP, MSproject crashes. This is my problem.

I'm TRYING to work with the tools that I currently have, but am now thinking
more and more about the collaborative merits of the Hansoft PPM tool

 

[Rob Schneider]

See embedded marked by rms=>>

Sorry, I thought I'd explained it pretty clearly. Here's more info...

This is a large games project, so we have producers responsible for art,
code, animation, audio etc. Each of these guys is making a schedule of all
their team's work to the end of the project. They each have a seperate MPP
for their team's work. One for the art, one for the animations etc. The tasks
in each file run into the hundreds and even thousands.

rms==>I'm currently working on a set of about 70 MPP files each with
about 100-200 line item tasks. Each of those MPP files are
inserted/linked as subprojects into about a dozen master files. Each of
those master files are inserted/linked into what's best described as the
"super-master" file. This makes the top level master file holding
approximately 10-12,000 tasks. No problem.

I've got all these seperate MPP files inserted into a master file, so that I
can level everything and make sure that their work won't overrun key
milestone dates. This allows the producers to update their own MPPs without
having to worry about the contention that would arise if EVERYTHING was in
one giant MPP.

Each month, I want to move tasks, selected from their mpp files into one
place so that the ENTIRE team can see what they need to be working on for
that month. Having all the tasks for a month's milestone in one place makes
it easier for the team to work out the intricate dependencies that exist
between the work.

rms==>>This is is the bit I don't understand. I don't see the value in
"moving" tasks. In your master project, why not use a filter which
shows only tasks being worked on during month? And I really don't
understand what you mean by moving "selected" tasks. I infer you are
selecting tasks from one MPP, copying, then pasting into another. Not a
good practice at all and surely will lead to project and computer
issues. Focus on viewing and reporting on the project from the master
by using filters, grouping, etc.

If I expand one of the inserted files, click on a task and drag it into the
parent MPP, MSproject crashes. This is my problem.

rms==>I also don't get this. I understand "expand one of the inserted
files" if that means you are doing it from the master project file. But
then I don't understand purpose of clicking "on a task" and dragging
into "parent". If you do this all from the MASTER file where the
subprojects are inserted, then there is no need to do any dragging. I
use the nomenclature master and subproject specifically as those are the
terms you can read about in Project's Help file which explains all this.

rms==>Regardless of whether Project is crashing or not (and I agree it
is reasonable to expect that it not crash), I think you are mis-using
Project and putting your project at risk.

I'm TRYING to work with the tools that I currently have, but am now thinking
more and more about the collaborative merits of the Hansoft PPM tool

rms==>Don't know anything about Hansoft PPM tool. But I do suspect you
are mis-using Project and if you mis-use Hansoft PPM you'll also get
weirdness. The trick here is to use the tool as expects to be used.

 

[John]

Sorry, I thought I'd explained it pretty clearly. Here's more info...

This is a large games project, so we have producers responsible for art,
code, animation, audio etc. Each of these guys is making a schedule of all
their team's work to the end of the project. They each have a seperate MPP
for their team's work. One for the art, one for the animations etc. The tasks
in each file run into the hundreds and even thousands.

I've got all these seperate MPP files inserted into a master file, so that I
can level everything and make sure that their work won't overrun key
milestone dates. This allows the producers to update their own MPPs without
having to worry about the contention that would arise if EVERYTHING was in
one giant MPP.

Each month, I want to move tasks, selected from their mpp files into one
place so that the ENTIRE team can see what they need to be working on for
that month. Having all the tasks for a month's milestone in one place makes
it easier for the team to work out the intricate dependencies that exist
between the work.
If I expand one of the inserted files, click on a task and drag it into the
parent MPP, MSproject crashes. This is my problem.

I'm TRYING to work with the tools that I currently have, but am now thinking
more and more about the collaborative merits of the Hansoft PPM tool

Andy,
I guess you did explain it but I couldn't quite believe what I was
reading. Apparently Rob couldn't either and I think he summed it up
pretty well. I would add just one thing. It's probably a good thing that
Project is crashing. Dragging and dropping selected tasks from an
inserted project into the master is creating a configuration that is
ripe for corruption. Perhaps Project is telling you that what you are
doing is not a good idea at all. Links in Project, including those
between a master and its subprojects, are not at all robust. Keeping
things operating smoothly and avoiding corruption requires diligence and
following basic good practices on the user's part.

I was going to suggest that each month you create a static master. That
is, unlink all the subprojects and then selectively edit the static
master so it contains only those tasks of interest for the month. Then
you mentioned that you have intricate dependencies between tasks in the
subprojects. When a dynamic master is converted to a static master those
links are lost unless a VBA procedure is used to preserve the logic
structure. I do have such a macro but it is not freeware.

John
Project MVP