Critical Path Does Not Seem Correct

D

Darin Ingenito

Hello,
This is my first official project plan and I am having trouble with the
critical path. I know how to calculate it using the forward/backward pass,
but for some reason the Critical path in my project plan looks strange. One
thing that I can say is that I have some childern tasks linked to summary
tasks. I am going to try to calculate it using Excel, but I may have
problems since I am linking child/summary tasks. Not sure. I can email a
copy of the plan if somenone knows how to troubleshoot/validate the critical
path in MS Project.

Thank you.
 
J

Jan De Messemaeker

Hi,

Did you enter any start or finish dates yourself? Or did you use
constraints?
 
J

Jim Aksel

First, remove the links at summary levels. If necessary add a milestone
underneath the summary that makes the links you may need.

Second, remove Level of Effort tasks from the schedule. Long tasks such as
"Project Manamgement" and the like will pollute your critical path. We keep
LOE tasks in a separate plan.

See if that helps.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim
It''s software; it''s not allowed to win.

Visit http://project.mvps.org/ for FAQs and more information
about Microsoft Project
 
J

John

Darin Ingenito said:
Hello,
This is my first official project plan and I am having trouble with the
critical path. I know how to calculate it using the forward/backward pass,
but for some reason the Critical path in my project plan looks strange. One
thing that I can say is that I have some childern tasks linked to summary
tasks. I am going to try to calculate it using Excel, but I may have
problems since I am linking child/summary tasks. Not sure. I can email a
copy of the plan if somenone knows how to troubleshoot/validate the critical
path in MS Project.

Thank you.

Darin,
First of all, you don't have to "calculate" the critical path at all.
Project does that automatically. One of the best ways to get more
information on how Project does that is to insert the Critical field as
a column in the Gantt Chart view. Then hover you mouse over the column
title until a pop-up appears that will take you to the help topic.

However a couple of things you said are cause for concern. First you
mention forward/backward pass. To me that implies that you have forward
(good) and backward (bad) links between tasks. Backward links are prime
fodder for creating circular relationships and a whole truckload of
problems with a schedule.

Second, you mention links on summary lines. That is inherently a bad
idea (second truckload of problems). You should go to our MVP website
at, http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm, and take a look at FAQ 48 -
Summary Task Linking.

Read the FAQ, clean up your file structure, and read about how Project
calculates critical path. Then if you still have a question, post again.

John
Project MVP
 
D

Darin Ingenito

no, but i do have some "Must Start On" constraints. I am going to try to
remove the summary links as suggested by John. Funny thing is that my
critical path is only those tasks with the "Must Start On" constraints. I am
going to try and fix now.

Thank you.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

I'll do that. Regarding summary task links, I was taking guidance from the
following book - "Using Project 2000, Special Edition, ISBN #0-7897-2253-4,
Que Publishing".

There is a section on how to link tasks when your proj plan has summary
tasks. It gives you four different approaches, which made sense to me. For
example, it talked about linking all summary tasks then linking subtasks in
within each section. That is what I have now which is not working. I tried
2 other approaches as well - same result. I'll let you know what happens.

Thank you.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Jim - just clarifying what you mean by Level of Effort Tasks. Do you mean
"Effort Driven Tasks"?

Thanks.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Ok. Cleaned up file structure. Removed all summary links. Dropped in
"Milestone Tasks" for major completion phases. Relinked children tasks
making sure everything was picked up. Added the Critical column on Gantt
Chart view. Back to same result. It looks like all tasks with the "Must
Start On" constraint are being picked up as critical. Maybe this is
possible, but still looks strange.

Any more suggestions would be appreciated,

Thanks.
 
J

Jan De Messemaeker

Hi,

Perfectly normal; Must Start On tasks have no Slack so they are critical.
If you want to see the critical path kllet Project calculate the dates
 
J

Jan De Messemaeker

See my other post. Tasks are critical when they have no slack, and MSO tasks
don't have any.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Jan -

Just clarifying my problem. I have around 150 tasks (incl Summary). only 5
are showing up as critical tasks (the ones with the Must start on
constraint). I am questioning why i only have 5. i would expect to see more
tasks that are critical, correct? it just seems strange that i only have 5
which are mso. if i display the free slack column i do see other tasks with
zero slack.

thanks.
 
D

davegb

Jan -

Just clarifying my problem. I have around 150 tasks (incl Summary). only 5
are showing up as critical tasks (the ones with the Must start on
constraint). I am questioning why i only have 5. i would expect to see more
tasks that are critical, correct? it just seems strange that i only have 5
which are mso. if i display the free slack column i do see other tasks with
zero slack.

thanks.



Jan De Messemaeker said:
See my other post. Tasks are critical when they have no slack, and MSO tasks
don't have any.
--
Jan De Messemaeker
Microsoft Project MVP
http://users.online.be/prom-ade
Darin Ingenito said:
Ok. Cleaned up file structure. Removed all summary links. Dropped in
"Milestone Tasks" for major completion phases. Relinked children tasks
making sure everything was picked up. Added the Critical column on Gantt
Chart view. Back to same result. It looks like all tasks with the "Must
Start On" constraint are being picked up as critical. Maybe this is
possible, but still looks strange.
Any more suggestions would be appreciated,
Thanks.
:


- Show quoted text -

The number of critical tasks is unimportant. The main thing to look
for to see if your CP is correct is if it spans from the beginning of
your project to the end. If it only spans part of the total duration,
the most common culprit is constraints, as mentioned by Jan. These are
the first thing you need to remove, at least until you're confident
that you have a correct CP. If they are real world constraints, not
just arbitrary ones, you may have to put them back, and your CP will
only partially display again. Constraints can, and often do, create
Total Slack (and Free Slack), so checking TS while constraints are
present may not give you all the information you need to trouble shoot
your CP.

Another issue can be Actual dates. If you've entered any of these, and
they are not the same as the current start and finish dates, they too
can throw off your CP, just as Constraints can.

As for the forward and backward passes, you don't need to worry about
them. Project is doing both as best it can within the limits you've
given it. If Calculation is turned on, it's doing both the Forward
Pass and the Backward Pass automatically.

The other key factor here is Schedule Continuity. If you don't have
that, you'll probably have some CP problems. You can search this NG
for more information on SC.

Hope this helps in your world.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Dave not sure what you meant by NG.

I would like to find out more info on Schedule Continuity.

Thanks,
Darin

 
M

Mike Glen

NG = newsgroup.

Mike Glen
Project MVP


Darin Ingenito said:
Dave not sure what you meant by NG.

I would like to find out more info on Schedule Continuity.

Thanks,
Darin
 
S

Steve House

"Must Start On" constraints mean that the task WILL take place on that date
regardless of anything that happens in or to the project. It does NOT mean
that the task is required to start on that date - it might be very important
that it do so but there are things that might make it impossible for it to
happen that way - parts on backorder, resource hit by a trucki, etc. The
MSO constrain means there is nothing at all, no force or nature, n o
decision you might make, that will make that task start on any other than
the designated date. Obviously such things are few and far between in the
real world. IMHO, your first step is to remove those constraints.
Secondly, good network design practice say that 1:you have at least a start
and a finish milestone; and 2: ALL tasks must have at least one predecessor
and at least one successor - if a task has no activity as its predecessor,
the start milestone is its predecessor and if it has no activity as its
successor, the finish milestone is its successor.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Steve,

I displayed the Successor column on my Gantt chart view. Corrected tasks
that did not have a successor. IT WORKED!! Thank you.

I was trying to audit the network using "Network Diagram" but got lost there
(too many tasks). Since my project plan was using outlining, I must of
missed linking these tasks. This seemed to be an easy way to audit this.
Would you agree?

Thanks again.

Steve House said:
"Must Start On" constraints mean that the task WILL take place on that date
regardless of anything that happens in or to the project. It does NOT mean
that the task is required to start on that date - it might be very important
that it do so but there are things that might make it impossible for it to
happen that way - parts on backorder, resource hit by a trucki, etc. The
MSO constrain means there is nothing at all, no force or nature, n o
decision you might make, that will make that task start on any other than
the designated date. Obviously such things are few and far between in the
real world. IMHO, your first step is to remove those constraints.
Secondly, good network design practice say that 1:you have at least a start
and a finish milestone; and 2: ALL tasks must have at least one predecessor
and at least one successor - if a task has no activity as its predecessor,
the start milestone is its predecessor and if it has no activity as its
successor, the finish milestone is its successor.
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs



Darin Ingenito said:
no, but i do have some "Must Start On" constraints. I am going to try to
remove the summary links as suggested by John. Funny thing is that my
critical path is only those tasks with the "Must Start On" constraints. I
am
going to try and fix now.

Thank you.
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Steve,

One more question. I did get the critical path to calculate properly after
applying your suggestions.

As a test - I added back some Must Start On constraints which then affected
the critical path. The tasks that I am trying to add are software parallel
dates - they must happen on these specific dates - due to the company's
financial calendar. How can I reflect these dates properly without
negatively affecting the critical path calc?

Thanks again,
Darin

Steve House said:
"Must Start On" constraints mean that the task WILL take place on that date
regardless of anything that happens in or to the project. It does NOT mean
that the task is required to start on that date - it might be very important
that it do so but there are things that might make it impossible for it to
happen that way - parts on backorder, resource hit by a trucki, etc. The
MSO constrain means there is nothing at all, no force or nature, n o
decision you might make, that will make that task start on any other than
the designated date. Obviously such things are few and far between in the
real world. IMHO, your first step is to remove those constraints.
Secondly, good network design practice say that 1:you have at least a start
and a finish milestone; and 2: ALL tasks must have at least one predecessor
and at least one successor - if a task has no activity as its predecessor,
the start milestone is its predecessor and if it has no activity as its
successor, the finish milestone is its successor.
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs



Darin Ingenito said:
no, but i do have some "Must Start On" constraints. I am going to try to
remove the summary links as suggested by John. Funny thing is that my
critical path is only those tasks with the "Must Start On" constraints. I
am
going to try and fix now.

Thank you.
 
D

davegb

Dave not sure what you meant by NG.

I would like to find out more info on Schedule Continuity.

Thanks,
Darin



davegb said:
Jan -
Just clarifying my problem. I have around 150 tasks (incl Summary). only 5
are showing up as critical tasks (the ones with the Must start on
constraint). I am questioning why i only have 5. i would expect to see more
tasks that are critical, correct? it just seems strange that i only have 5
which are mso. if i display the free slack column i do see other tasks with
zero slack.
thanks.
:
See my other post. Tasks are critical when they have no slack, and MSO tasks
don't have any.
--
Jan De Messemaeker
Microsoft Project MVP
http://users.online.be/prom-ade
Ok. Cleaned up file structure. Removed all summary links. Dropped in
"Milestone Tasks" for major completion phases. Relinked children tasks
making sure everything was picked up. Added the Critical column on Gantt
Chart view. Back to same result. It looks like all tasks with the "Must
Start On" constraint are being picked up as critical. Maybe this is
possible, but still looks strange.
Any more suggestions would be appreciated,
Thanks.
:







- Show quoted text -

NG=News Group. This is a News Group dealing w/ MS Project. I've
already posted here a number of times on SC, so it shouldn't be hard
to find.
 
D

davegb

Steve,

One more question. I did get the critical path to calculate properly after
applying your suggestions.

As a test - I added back some Must Start On constraints which then affected
the critical path. The tasks that I am trying to add are software parallel
dates - they must happen on these specific dates - due to the company's
financial calendar. How can I reflect these dates properly without
negatively affecting the critical path calc?

Thanks again,
Darin

Darin,
Steve and I have a long standing debate on the use of constraints, so
I'll give you a different interpretation of how they are used. I
believe that they apply to more than eclipses of the sun. What would
be the point of even having them? The criteria of "no force on earth
can prevent them from happening" seems extreme to me. They way I use
them is that it's deemed crucial to the Project that this event happen
on time. This does not mean something like, "management would like it
to happen", but something like, for example, a scheduled event that
needs to take place or major problems will arise. A specific example
might be a meeting to bring together project stakeholders to discuss
key issues on the project. If You've planned it for Monday, Sept. 12 a
month in advance, and a hundred people have bought airline tickets and
reserved hotel rooms, not to mention opened time in their schedules
for a couple of days that week, you can hardly ask them on Friday the
9th to postpone the trip a week or two. It must happen at that time,
barring acts of nature, etc. This is an appropriate situation for a
MSO constraint. Others might be announced product rollouts, government
mandates, training, etc. There are lots of things that are cause for
MSO or MFO constraints, but they aren't usually daily kinds of
events.

In dealing with these, they can create slack, and cause your CP to
dissappear. When you have an "M" constraint (MSO or MFO), and the work
that needs to be done afterwards doesn't fill the time between that
and your end date, or another "M" constraint, God forbid, you have
slack in your schedule. There's no way around it. It's a fact of life.
Like many unpleasant facts of life, we can pretend it's not so, or
address it.

The way I address this particular fact of life is to insert a dummy
task after the string of tasks following the M task, right before the
Finish Milestone (or the next M task). For example, if I have a task
that must finish on Sep. 12, and the end of my project is four weeks
later, and I have 3 weeks of work to do in that four weeks, the "M"
constraint has caused a week of slack. That's reality. And there's no
CP from that point forward because of that week of slack. So I just
put in a dummy task with a week duration at the end of the string of
tasks following the M task. That replaces the slack with a phony task
and restores your CP. If any of the tasks in that part of the schedule
slips, it will try to put off the end date. When you see that
happening, you simply decrease the duration of your dummy task
accordingly and restore your end date to it's planned date and restore
your CP. Hopefully, there are not too many of these, and there
shouldn't be.

Of course, the opposite can occur. You don't have sufficient time
between the M task and the Finish Milestone to get the work done. Four
weeks of work in three weeks! This is even more common. And this is
dealt with by attacking the CP, as in most schedules. Nothing at all
new here!

I hope this helps give you a real world solution for your real world
problem. Scheduling is a pretty exact science, but it does require
flexibility in application to make it fit with reality and still
function as intended.

Best of luck. Let me know if you need further assistance!
 
D

Darin Ingenito

Dave,
Thank you for the info, it was very helpful. What I did now was to take a
very basic proj plan (15 tasks) with all the pred/success set up correctly
(via a textbook example). Critical path in Project matched my calculation in
Excel.

Added A MSO constraint and then tried to add a dummy task with the extra
slack that I had created (1 week). I was unable to get back to the original
CP.

I then tried to use lag/lead time to get to my MSO dates. I was then able
to not affect the CP. To me, this seemed to work.

What do you think?

Thanks again,
Darin
 

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