Database corrupted, but DB Utility says it's OK

[Julian Vrieslander]

Entourage 2004 was throwing alerts about DB corruption, so I did a
rebuild with Database Utility. The Verify operation then reported that
my DB was OK.

Then I upgraded to Office 2008, deleting the 2004 apps when prompted by
the installer. Applied the Office 12.0.1 update.

Now I am seeing indications of DB corruption again:

1) Duplicate items in the message lists for my POP account.

2) Other items appear in the message lists, but cannot be opened. If I
am not using Preview Pane, double clicking one of these items does
nothing. If I am using Preview Pane, clicking on the item shows nothing
in preview. Or it may display a header in preview, but no body content.

3) Furthermore, if I am using Preview Pane, and I select one of these
ghost items, Entourage behaves very unreliably. Changing the selection
to another message item reveals nothing in the preview (even though it
was displaying correctly before). Or Entourage crashes, with an alert
reporting "Microsoft Entourage has encountered a problem and needs to
close. We are sorry for the inconvenience."

I ran the Verify operation in Database Utility (2008 version), and it
reports that my DB is "working correctly". It appears that the Database
Utility cannot be trusted to detect all forms of damage.

I checked my available backups, and the problem with the ghost messages
exists in those copies, too. It went undetected for weeks.

So what do I do now? I am very close to giving up on Entourage. This
makes me sad. I've been using versions of this product since the
earliest Emailer from Fog City.

Entourage 12.0.1, Leopard 10.5.2 with all recent updates. Same behavior
seen on Mac Pro and MacBook Pro.

 

[Diane Ross]

Entourage 2004 was throwing alerts about DB corruption, so I did a
rebuild with Database Utility. The Verify operation then reported that
my DB was OK.

Could be a bad preference file causing the alerts in Office 2004, but I
suspect it was database problems. Verify is not 100%.

Try deleting this preference file in your User's --> Library Preferences:

com.microsoft.OfficeNotifications.plist

Then I upgraded to Office 2008, deleting the 2004 apps when prompted by
the installer. Applied the Office 12.0.1 update.

Sorry, but that was a bad idea. Not yours but Microsoft in having you remove
it before you had a stable Office 2008 install.

Now I am seeing indications of DB corruption again:

Many users are having problems with updated databases.

So what do I do now?

You definitely have database corruption. We need to manually move your data.
There are two ways we can go about this. The first would be to install
Office 2004 again (messing up fonts installed by 08), or second is to try
and export from what you have.

IF you have any Identity that will open, we can use that. Even placing an 04
Identity in the Entourage 2008 Identity folder will cause it to upgrade.
Once it is open, export. Best case scenario is to have Entourage 2004 open
and export from it. You could always go back and reinstall. I would use
"Remove Office" and remove 08 first. Install 04 and update to at least
11.3.5, export your data, then install and update Office 2008. This will
take care of your font issues.

Follow the directions here:

How to manually move your data:

<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/install/manual_install.html>

Once you get your data into Entourage manually, it actually works as
expected. Something in the import process is flawed for many users.

I am very close to giving up on Entourage. This
makes me sad. I've been using versions of this product since the
earliest Emailer from Fog City.

Can't have that. I'm was an Emailer user too. Read my article on the History
of Entourage:

<http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/2007/05/in_the_beginning.html>

Office 2008 Font Install Basics:

Office 2008 uses a different method for fonts and many fonts are new
versions. Office 2008 will install fonts to the /Library/Fonts/Microsoft
folder. By being at the root, then all users on the machine have access to
them and you don't get Office 2008 putting multiple copies on the machine
for each user.

The installer will scour /Library/Fonts/ and ~/Library/Fonts/ for fonts with
the same name and move them to /Library/Disabled Fonts/ or
~/Library/Disabled Fonts/ depending on where they were found.

Let me know how this goes.

 

[Julian Vrieslander]

Could be a bad preference file causing the alerts in Office 2004, but I
suspect it was database problems. Verify is not 100%.

Try deleting this preference file in your User's --> Library Preferences:

com.microsoft.OfficeNotifications.plist

Thanks for the reply, Diane. Long time, no read. It took me a while to
realize that the Entourage-Talk list was dead.

Earlier today I was reading some of the suggestions on the Entourage
Help Page, and (for one of my affected Macs) I did try removing that
prefs file, and then rebuilding the database in Ent 08. Some of the
problematic "ghost" messages were not present in the rebuilt database.
But some other messages reappeared in duplicate - and these were old
messages, no longer on the POP server. I don't know yet if this last
rebuild will solve the crashing problems I've been seeing.

Sorry, but that was a bad idea. Not yours but Microsoft in having you remove
it before you had a stable Office 2008 install.

When Ent 08 converted my Ent 04 database, it made a new one, and left
the old database file in place. But I (foolishly) deleted the old file
before I realized that the new one was still corrupted. At that time, I
thought that both databases were OK.

Many users are having problems with updated databases.

So I've noticed.

You definitely have database corruption. We need to manually move your data.
There are two ways we can go about this. The first would be to install
Office 2004 again (messing up fonts installed by 08), or second is to try
and export from what you have.

IF you have any Identity that will open, we can use that.

My Main Identities will open on both the Mac Pro and MacBook Pro. Most
of the time, they function correctly. It's only occasionally that I one
of those "ghost" messages without a body, and only occasionally that I
see a crash.

Even placing an 04
Identity in the Entourage 2008 Identity folder will cause it to upgrade.

Alas, I do not have any remaining backups of my 04 databases. I thought
that they were fixed when I upgraded to 08, and I backed up my converted
08 databases, overwriting the old ones. Perhaps that was too hasty on
my part. But these big database files do no lend themselves well to an
incremental backup strategy. Many of us are excluding the Entourage
database from Time Machine, and using a cloning backup method (like
SuperDuper) for these files.

Once it is open, export. Best case scenario is to have Entourage 2004 open
and export from it. You could always go back and reinstall. I would use
"Remove Office" and remove 08 first. Install 04 and update to at least
11.3.5, export your data, then install and update Office 2008. This will
take care of your font issues.

Does this "best case scenario" assume that I have an 04 database
available? If I do not have any copies of my 04 databases, does it
make sense at this point to remove Entourage 08 and reinstall 04?
Furthermore, I'm not seeing font issues.

Follow the directions here:

How to manually move your data:

<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/install/manual_install.html>

Once you get your data into Entourage manually, it actually works as
expected. Something in the import process is flawed for many users.

Yes, I saw that page this morning. I may try this in a few days, if my
problems continue. Right now, I can't spare the time.

Can't have that. I'm was an Emailer user too. Read my article on the History
of Entourage:

<http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/2007/05/in_the_beginning.html>

I've read that article before. Makes me feel like picking up my high
school yearbook. I can still recall the enthusiastic user community on
the old Emailer list, and the excitement that would break out whenever
someone posted a clever new AppleScript.

 

[Diane Ross]

Does this "best case scenario" assume that I have an 04 database
available? If I do not have any copies of my 04 databases, does it
make sense at this point to remove Entourage 08 and reinstall 04?

From what you are describing, I would just use the current 08 database and
export it manually. Right now make a backup and set to leave mail on server
to cover your bases. Even dragging mail to the desktop as individual
messages each day that you sent would cover you in case the worst case
scenario happens.

Like I said, once you get the data manually over to a new 08 database it
works like a charm. I have not had one problem with my database and I have
put it through it's paces.

 

[Julian Vrieslander]

From what you are describing, I would just use the current 08 database and
export it manually.

I've looked at the instructions on the web page

http://www.entourage.mvps.org/install/manual_install.html

In my case, it looks like I need to do option #2 on this page, moving
data from my (possibly corrupted) Entourage 2008 database into the
database of a newly created Entourage 2008 identity.

The instructions on that page are a bit unclear, however. The
recommendations for Entourage X, 2004, and 2008 are intermixed, and I'm
not certain which parts apply to which app version. There is a
screenshot which suggests that in Entourage 2008, the Export archive and
Import archive commands can transfer email data. But further down the
page, there are directions for moving email data by exporting and
importing MBOX files. Is the MBOX method only needed for Entourage X
and 2004? Or is it included here as a fallback if the transfer via
archive does not work?

I have a couple of possibly related questions. If I am not using sync
services, is it OK to synchronize my desktop and laptop Macs by simply
copying the Main Identity folder from one computer to the other? I
occasionally do this when I take the laptop on trips. Or is it better
to transfer the data via the Export/Import archive mechanism? Is it
possible that my method is what was causing DB corruption?

Hmmm, I just noticed that the Entourage online help claims that the
Export/Import archive mechanism loses category information, except for
contacts. This would be a pain for me, since I use categories for
calendar events and reminders. I would hate to lose that information
for previously saved entries.

 

[Diane Ross]

The instructions on that page are a bit unclear, however.

I'll work on that. Would you mind being a helper for that offline?

Is the MBOX method only needed for Entourage X
and 2004? Or is it included here as a fallback if the transfer via
archive does not work?

MBOX is just another way to export. Entourage X does not have the export as
Entourage archive (.rge) so this option is a must for them.

I have a couple of possibly related questions. If I am not using sync
services, is it OK to synchronize my desktop and laptop Macs by simply
copying the Main Identity folder from one computer to the other?
Yes
I
occasionally do this when I take the laptop on trips. Or is it better
to transfer the data via the Export/Import archive mechanism? Is it
possible that my method is what was causing DB corruption?
Doubtful.

Hmmm, I just noticed that the Entourage online help claims that the
Export/Import archive mechanism loses category information, except for
contacts. This would be a pain for me, since I use categories for
calendar events and reminders. I would hate to lose that information
for previously saved entries.

Paul Berkowitz's export-import scripts gets everything. Worth the $20.

 

[Julian Vrieslander]

Hmmm, I just noticed that the Entourage online help claims that the
Export/Import archive mechanism loses category information, except for
contacts. This would be a pain for me, since I use categories for
calendar events and reminders. I would hate to lose that information
for previously saved entries.

Paul Berkowitz's export-import scripts gets everything. Worth the $20.[/QUOTE]

I would gladly pay the $20 (and I've considered buying his scripts
package several times in the past). But the notes on MacScripter and on
Paul's site do not confirm compatibility with Leopard or Entourage 2008.
I guess I should email him and ask if it works on the current versions.

 

[Diane Ross]

I would gladly pay the $20 (and I've considered buying his scripts
package several times in the past). But the notes on MacScripter and on
Paul's site do not confirm compatibility with Leopard or Entourage 2008.
I guess I should email him and ask if it works on the current versions.

I've used them with Leopard and Entourage 2008 and they still work. Did not
use all of them, but the ones I did use did work. I know Paul is really busy
now...had a job promotion... And might take some time to get back.

 

[Ivar Klaas]

I've used them with Leopard and Entourage 2008 and they still work. Did not
use all of them, but the ones I did use did work. I know Paul is really busy
now...had a job promotion... And might take some time to get back.

Nope, do not waste your good money, it does NOT work!

I just bought it because Diane said they worked for her, contrary to the
websites remarks. I figured if Diane say it it must be true (since it always
is! ;-)) but not in this case. The particular script I tried: Notes.......

Sorry,

Ivar