date modified changes when file is opened

[GM]

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Whenever I open some Microsoft Office files (Word, PowerPoint) the "date modified" changes to the current date and time, even though I have not modified anything in the file. It seems to happen only with files that are at least a few months old, before I got my current Mac. How do I stop this from happening? This question was asked last year and has not been answered.

This is very very disturbing, as all my files are organized by "date modified." If I don't find a solution to this, it will be the final nail in the coffin of Microsoft for me, and I'll be forced to switch to Apple and open-source applications.

 

[John McGhie]

Well, I don't think anyone reading in here has any problem with you using
Apple and Open Source applications. It's a free world: if you want to do
that, it's of no concern to us.

However: You should be aware that the Microsoft application does not write
the "Date Modified", it is written by Apple's OS. No change Microsoft could
make would alter this behaviour.

You may wish to check your documents from dynamic content. For example:
fields containing the "Date" will update each time the file opens, and force
a save each time the file closes. Page numbers will do it, tables of
contents, tracked changes...

Anything that updates automatically will force a document save on close, and
the OS will update the Last Changed date to be correct (because the file HAS
changed).

It's also possible to introduce this bug by incorrect settings on the
server. When an editing application opens the document, it sets an edit
lock on the file. If the application then does not save the file, the
server should dismiss the lock and leave the file dates unchanged. It is
possible to set Mac OS X so that doesn't happen correctly.

I just opened a file with Word that shows a Date Modified of 10/08/2007. I
opened it, made a change, then cancelled the change and refreshed the folder
list.

It still shows "Date Modified" of 10/08/2007.

Hope this helps

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Whenever I open some Microsoft Office files (Word, PowerPoint) the "date
modified" changes to the current date and time, even though I have not
modified anything in the file. It seems to happen only with files that are at
least a few months old, before I got my current Mac. How do I stop this from
happening? This question was asked last year and has not been answered.

This is very very disturbing, as all my files are organized by "date
modified." If I don't find a solution to this, it will be the final nail in
the coffin of Microsoft for me, and I'll be forced to switch to Apple and
open-source applications.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Sydney, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[Phillip Jones, C.E.T.]

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Whenever I open some Microsoft Office files (Word, PowerPoint) the "date modified" changes to the current date and time, even though I have not modified anything in the file. It seems to happen only with files that are at least a few months old, before I got my current Mac. How do I stop this from happening? This question was asked last year and has not been answered.

This is very very disturbing, as all my files are organized by "date modified." If I don't find a solution to this, it will be the final nail in the coffin of Microsoft for me, and I'll be forced to switch to Apple and open-source applications.

In a lot of cases just the act of opening and closing a file will
change modification date. But unless you actually made some changes. The
file has not been changed. This applies not only to MS products but many
other applications.

 

[pglick]

I have seen this problem as well and can add that it only happens when you open a .doc file (Word 97-2004) with the latest version of Word:mac 2008. It does not have to do with when the file was created. However, it does only happen when the file resides on a network file server, but only when the file must be converted from doc to docx format. It does not happen when the file is on the local disk.

I have created a .doc file with Word:mac 2008, closed the document and a few minutes later reopened it. The file modify time is changed when the file is opened.

Word is modifying some attribute of the file when the conversion occurs instead of when the file is written. I don't have a solution.

 

[Scott]

I have seen this problem as well and can add that it only happens when you open a .doc file (Word 97-2004) with the latest version of Word:mac 2008.It does not have to do with when the file was created. However, it does only happen when the file resides on a network file server, but only when thefile must be converted from doc to docx format. It does not happen when the file is on the local disk.

I have created a .doc file with Word:mac 2008, closed the document and a few minutes later reopened it. The file modify time is changed when the file is opened.

Word is modifying some attribute of the file when the conversion occurs instead of when the file is written. I don't have a solution.

This is almost the behavior I am seeing.

Files created in Word 2004 and residing on a server have their
modification dates when opened and closed, but with no changes made
and no "Save" made.

Open file on server, make a change, and save. Re-open and same
behavior occurs.

Duplicate file on server, open duplicate, and NO change to date is
made. Open original and date changes.

Open file on server, saveas with new name to server, close. Open this
new file and date does NOT change.

Open file on server, save as .docx, close, re-open and date change
does NOT occur.

Copy the same file to a local computer, open it (the modification date
does not change), make a change in the file and save locally, then
copy it back to the server - date change does NOT occur.

Create new Word file (.doc) on the server and close. Re-open and the
modification date does NOT change on open or close.

*** None of this odd behavior occurs with the same files when opened
in Word 2004 in the same ways as detailed above ***

Word 2008 does seem to be writing something to these older files. This
could also have something to do with ACLs as they are different on the
original file, the duplicated file, and the saveas file. But in any
case (IMHO) it appears that Word 2008 is writing something to the file
to allow it to operate. This is very difficult for a business where we
use these dates as "guides" and potential legal records.

 

[John McGhie]

I've asked one of the Microsoft engineers to take a look. There is, of
course, no guarantee that they will a) have time, or b) be able to fix
anything.

Please note: No user should rely on, and no court should accept, the dates
written to a file on a server as proof of anything. This information is far
too easily manipulated to be meaningful in a legal sense.

Cheers

This is almost the behavior I am seeing.

Files created in Word 2004 and residing on a server have their
modification dates when opened and closed, but with no changes made
and no "Save" made.

Open file on server, make a change, and save. Re-open and same
behavior occurs.

Duplicate file on server, open duplicate, and NO change to date is
made. Open original and date changes.

Open file on server, saveas with new name to server, close. Open this
new file and date does NOT change.

Open file on server, save as .docx, close, re-open and date change
does NOT occur.

Copy the same file to a local computer, open it (the modification date
does not change), make a change in the file and save locally, then
copy it back to the server - date change does NOT occur.

Create new Word file (.doc) on the server and close. Re-open and the
modification date does NOT change on open or close.

*** None of this odd behavior occurs with the same files when opened
in Word 2004 in the same ways as detailed above ***

Word 2008 does seem to be writing something to these older files. This
could also have something to do with ACLs as they are different on the
original file, the duplicated file, and the saveas file. But in any
case (IMHO) it appears that Word 2008 is writing something to the file
to allow it to operate. This is very difficult for a business where we
use these dates as "guides" and potential legal records.

This email is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless you intend to pay!

--

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[swg]

Cool, and thanks.

FYI: just tested creating a new Word 2004 .doc on the file server and opening it in Word 2008. I was watching the file (in the Finder) while Word 2008 was opening it. The date modified date changed briefly to the current time near teh end of opening the file, then changed back to the time it was created immediately after it showed on the screen (to a date/time a few hours earlier). This only occurred the first time opening it in Word 2008 - after that there was no apparent change...hmmm. Could be some strange ACL thing tat only recently got triggered - both the file server and Word 2008 are new implementations - been using Word 2008 for two months before the new server.

-swg

PS. agreed on the date/law issue - but having been through a discovery period before I know the lawyers DO look at these dates although they may not rely on them.