disk space

[Scott]

One other strange things that's cropped up in the last day or two....

What are the free disk space requirements for scratch files, and for
saving in general?

Again, Word 04.

I have a bunch of documents (all Word docs) that I'm keeping on a 15MB
disk image. The disk image is encrypted, so when I work on the
documents, I call up one of them via Word's Recent items, enter the
password, and the image is mounted. But that's background, not the
question.

I've had an error crop up recently:
------------------
The disk is full. Free some space on this drive, or save the document to
another disk. Try one or more of the following:
* Close any unneeded documents, programs, and windows.
* Save the document on another disk.
------------------

After closing that window, another pops up:

------------------
Saving the AutoRecovery file is postponed for [document name].
------------------

But immediately after closing the message windows, I can save the doc
normally; it seems that the message comes up when scheduled backups are
made. I can't say for CERTAIN that it is so limited, but it seems so.

There is, however, 9.8 MB free on the "disk." Too little? The two active
documents take up 760 kb and 56 kb; all of the documents combined take
up 5 MB. The Backup files are in the same directory (next to the
originals); the AutoRecovery path is the default location (the main
drive).

I used DiskWarrior on the main volume and on the mounted disk image. The
first time around, DW indeed found problems on the main volume (the boot
disk, and where Word is located), including a volume bitmap problem; the
mounted image had no errors. I thought that fixing this would solve
things, but it didn't--the same problem crops up.

DiskWarrior finds no errors anymore, and neither does TechTool Pro 4.
Still, Word regularly pops up the error messages.

Should I create a larger disk image and copy everything onto that?

 

[Elliott Roper]

What are the free disk space requirements for scratch files, and for
saving in general?

Again, Word 04.

I tried Omni Disk Sweeper on an encrypted sparse image. It normally
shows trashes and temps. It made little difference whther a Word doc on
it was open of r editing. I was too impatient to see what happened at
the auto-save interval.

I have a bunch of documents (all Word docs) that I'm keeping on a 15MB
disk image. The disk image is encrypted, so when I work on the
documents, I call up one of them via Word's Recent items, enter the
password, and the image is mounted. But that's background, not the
question.

15MB? I went for a 4.7GB sparse image. It does not take up any more
space till it needs it, and I know I can back it up to DVD.

I've had an error crop up recently:
------------------
The disk is full. Free some space on this drive, or save the document to
another disk. Try one or more of the following:
* Close any unneeded documents, programs, and windows.
* Save the document on another disk.
------------------

After closing that window, another pops up:

------------------
Saving the AutoRecovery file is postponed for [document name].
------------------

But immediately after closing the message windows, I can save the doc
normally; it seems that the message comes up when scheduled backups are
made. I can't say for CERTAIN that it is so limited, but it seems so.

It is possible that the backup slaps a lock on the whole encrypted
container file and Word is reporting its presence a little
elliptically.

I am a bit aghast that Word permits you to open the file inside while
there is a lock on the outside. Does it come up with a big (Read Only)
in the title bar?

There is, however, 9.8 MB free on the "disk." Too little? The two active
documents take up 760 kb and 56 kb; all of the documents combined take
up 5 MB. The Backup files are in the same directory (next to the
originals); the AutoRecovery path is the default location (the main
drive).

According to my Disk Sweeper test, that should be enough. Have you got
"allow fast saves" set in Word prefs? Received wisdom says that is a
Bad Idea and may guzzle space without limit when the moon is full.

Should I create a larger disk image and copy everything onto that?

It seems like a no-brainer. Use Disk Utility to create a sparse image
of obscene dimensions. If there were any allocation bitmap corruption
of the old image, it would be unlikely to be transferred to the fresh
one.

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Scott:

Word's scratch files are not normally in the same folder as the document.
They are usually in the Temp directory on your main drive.

Their size and number depends on many things, such as what you are doing to
the document. Potentially they can occupy 20 times the document size (I
guess they could theoretically increase to infinity if you are vigorously
editing a document that you never close, but I have never seen them go above
20 times the size of the document...)

The Postponed Autorecovery save is exactly as you describe it. It means
that Word was actually writing to the file when it wanted to checkpoint it.
When it completes the first write, the next autorecover will complete
normally. It's an expected contention Word handles automatically.

Hope this helps

One other strange things that's cropped up in the last day or two....

What are the free disk space requirements for scratch files, and for
saving in general?

Again, Word 04.

I have a bunch of documents (all Word docs) that I'm keeping on a 15MB
disk image. The disk image is encrypted, so when I work on the
documents, I call up one of them via Word's Recent items, enter the
password, and the image is mounted. But that's background, not the
question.

I've had an error crop up recently:
------------------
The disk is full. Free some space on this drive, or save the document to
another disk. Try one or more of the following:
* Close any unneeded documents, programs, and windows.
* Save the document on another disk.
------------------

After closing that window, another pops up:

------------------
Saving the AutoRecovery file is postponed for [document name].
------------------

But immediately after closing the message windows, I can save the doc
normally; it seems that the message comes up when scheduled backups are
made. I can't say for CERTAIN that it is so limited, but it seems so.

There is, however, 9.8 MB free on the "disk." Too little? The two active
documents take up 760 kb and 56 kb; all of the documents combined take
up 5 MB. The Backup files are in the same directory (next to the
originals); the AutoRecovery path is the default location (the main
drive).

I used DiskWarrior on the main volume and on the mounted disk image. The
first time around, DW indeed found problems on the main volume (the boot
disk, and where Word is located), including a volume bitmap problem; the
mounted image had no errors. I thought that fixing this would solve
things, but it didn't--the same problem crops up.

DiskWarrior finds no errors anymore, and neither does TechTool Pro 4.
Still, Word regularly pops up the error messages.

Should I create a larger disk image and copy everything onto that?

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 4 1209 1410

 

[Scott]

Their size and number depends on many things, such as what you are doing to
the document. Potentially they can occupy 20 times the document size (I
guess they could theoretically increase to infinity if you are vigorously
editing a document that you never close, but I have never seen them go above
20 times the size of the document...)

Plenty of free space on the main drive, so that's not the problem.

The Postponed Autorecovery save is exactly as you describe it. It means
that Word was actually writing to the file when it wanted to checkpoint it.
When it completes the first write, the next autorecover will complete
normally. It's an expected contention Word handles automatically.

Why would the alert occur frequently? I.e., a half-dozen times over a
few hours.

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Scott:

Why would the alert occur frequently? I.e., a half-dozen times over a
few hours.

Because the condition occurs half-a-dozen times over a few hours

It's likely that Word is having problems saving the file dure to restricted
disk space. If your Autorecovery period is set to something short (e.g. 1
minutes) and Word is taking more than a minute to save the file, you will
get it every time.

I think the problem you have is that Word can't get that file saved, and the
error you are seeing is a symptom of that.

Sorry

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 4 1209 1410

 

[Scott]

Because the condition occurs half-a-dozen times over a few hours

It's likely that Word is having problems saving the file dure to restricted
disk space. If your Autorecovery period is set to something short (e.g. 1
minutes) and Word is taking more than a minute to save the file, you will
get it every time.

Ah, that part explains it somewhat. Does the AutoRecovery save take
longer than a normal save? If I just save the file, it's finished (as
measured by the progress bar) in a second or two.

Since the AutoRecovery file is in a different location, though,
*without* the disk size limitation since it's on the main drive (hmmm..
creating an unprotected copy, no?), it still encounters the problem

 

[Scott]

Again, Word 04.

15MB? I went for a 4.7GB sparse image. It does not take up any more
space till it needs it, and I know I can back it up to DVD.[/QUOTE]

I'll have to get myself to create a sparse image. I have the files
synched to a mounted image on my Powerbook (using Synk), so I'll have to
copy the new image itself over to the Powerbook, not just synchronize it.

I am a bit aghast that Word permits you to open the file inside while
there is a lock on the outside. Does it come up with a big (Read Only)
in the title bar?

If I use the recent items menu to open the file, it first demands the
password to the encrypted image, and only then mounts the volume and
opens the document. It words fine thereafter, until I unmount the
image's volume.

According to my Disk Sweeper test, that should be enough. Have you got
"allow fast saves" set in Word prefs? Received wisdom says that is a
Bad Idea and may guzzle space without limit when the moon is full.
<snip>

I don't have Fast Saves enabled. Even with a big document, normal saves
are fast enough on a 2x2GHz G5 that I don't see a need.

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Scott:

An AutoRecovery file is not a document, it's a list of edits to a document.
If you cannot open the main document, and autorecovery file will show you
nothing at all (if you open it in a byte editor, you see it's a table of
text fragments and pointers).

An AutoRecovery save takes about the same time as a normal save.

Don't EVER turn Fast Saves on. It's almost guaranteed document corruption.
It's not available on a network drive anyway: only on a local drive.

Fast Saves is a misnomer: what it really does is open the file for "Append".
Each time you do a fast save, Word appends the most recent version to the
end. Unless you have a slow, small disk, an ordinary save will actually be
faster than a "fast" save because there's less data to write.

Cheers

Ah, that part explains it somewhat. Does the AutoRecovery save take
longer than a normal save? If I just save the file, it's finished (as
measured by the progress bar) in a second or two.

Since the AutoRecovery file is in a different location, though,
*without* the disk size limitation since it's on the main drive (hmmm..
creating an unprotected copy, no?), it still encounters the problem

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 4 1209 1410