Document Title Property wont stay

[Stuart Weylandsmith]

Mac OSX 10.4.10 Office Word 11.3.5.


I use the document properties as inserted fields in many of the documents I
write. For some perplexing reason the 'title' property field refuses to
hold the data I enter. Well that is not quite true. If I enter something
like "Red Apples" in the title property I can update my document and
wherever this field is used it will be updated to "Red Apples". So far so
good. However, if I do something like attempt to print - an action that
generally attempts to update all fields within the document, the title
property will revert to the word "Subject" and all fields using the title
property will be updated to the word "Subject"

This is most perplexing. It doesn't happen with any of the other document
properties either the standard ones or any of the custom ones I have added.

I've tried removing all global and document templates. There are no macros
attached to the document. (In fact there are no Office macros full stop)


Anyone got a clue?

Stuart

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Stuart:

I'll give you three clues, but I can't be certain of any of them.

1) Some document properties will not update until you save and close the
document. Try that.

2) If you have a document property with "Link to content" enabled, strange
things will happen if you also update it without updating the content to
which you have linked it. This is the most likely cause of your particular
bother.

3) If a document corrupts, the Properties object can become read-only (or
parts of it can). This may be what's happening to you. To test this, copy
all but the last paragraph mark into a new blank document. If that fixes
it, you will have to reset the section properties manually.

Hope this helps

Mac OSX 10.4.10 Office Word 11.3.5.


I use the document properties as inserted fields in many of the documents I
write. For some perplexing reason the 'title' property field refuses to
hold the data I enter. Well that is not quite true. If I enter something
like "Red Apples" in the title property I can update my document and
wherever this field is used it will be updated to "Red Apples". So far so
good. However, if I do something like attempt to print - an action that
generally attempts to update all fields within the document, the title
property will revert to the word "Subject" and all fields using the title
property will be updated to the word "Subject"

This is most perplexing. It doesn't happen with any of the other document
properties either the standard ones or any of the custom ones I have added.

I've tried removing all global and document templates. There are no macros
attached to the document. (In fact there are no Office macros full stop)


Anyone got a clue?

Stuart

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[Stuart Weylandsmith]

Thanks John,

Option 1) Saving is being done first so wasn't this issue. Strangely the
text in the Title property in the template wasn't saved but replaced by some
other text - namely the word "Subject".

Option 2) I checked these out. Unless it is a default condition, I can't
find either "link to content" option for the standard document properties.
None of my custom properties had the "link to content" enabled - but then
again they weren't giving me any grief anyway.

Option 3) This looked promising so I gave it a try. In the process I
discovered something quite interesting. The first section of my document
template only had a first page. The second and third sections had the
"different first page" option disabled. Interestingly, hidden in the header
of the second page of the first section was a couple of fields drawing upon
my errant document property. I removed this unused second page header and
the problem seems to have gone away.

Why? I can but speculate. Could the standard document properties have a
default "link to content" option? If so, I had content within the document
that although hidden was automatically updating the title property. I don't
know but thanks to John I at least had some options to try and ended up with
a solution - at least for the present . .

Stuart

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Stuart:

Yeah, you had a "Corrupt Document". In your case, the corruption was in the
section break you removed.

The section break is just a marker: it doesn't exist as a character, but it
marks the position in the file where the "OLE Object Container Structure"
resides.

The OLE container contains everything in the document except the text,
including the properties. It's a complex linked list, tied together by
pointers. If you get a small corruption, the pointers start pointing at the
wrong things.

That's why this file format is so fragile, and why Microsoft changed to XML
for the next version.

Cheers

Thanks John,

Option 1) Saving is being done first so wasn't this issue. Strangely the
text in the Title property in the template wasn't saved but replaced by some
other text - namely the word "Subject".

Option 2) I checked these out. Unless it is a default condition, I can't
find either "link to content" option for the standard document properties.
None of my custom properties had the "link to content" enabled - but then
again they weren't giving me any grief anyway.

Option 3) This looked promising so I gave it a try. In the process I
discovered something quite interesting. The first section of my document
template only had a first page. The second and third sections had the
"different first page" option disabled. Interestingly, hidden in the header
of the second page of the first section was a couple of fields drawing upon
my errant document property. I removed this unused second page header and
the problem seems to have gone away.

Why? I can but speculate. Could the standard document properties have a
default "link to content" option? If so, I had content within the document
that although hidden was automatically updating the title property. I don't
know but thanks to John I at least had some options to try and ended up with
a solution - at least for the present . .

Stuart

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[Peter Jamieson]

Now you've provided that clue, the following experiment shows how this
/might/ easily happen:
a. you create a document and start by putting {the fields { Title } {
Subject } in the header. Except by mistake, you put { Title Subject }. I
suspect it's not well-known that such a field will update the title when
executed.
b. you change the layout so it's "different first page". However, the
header you entered is the standard "Header", so it now disappears from page
1, which now has the "First Page Header"
c. You change the title to mytitle, then save and close the document
d. You re-open the document, and one way or another, execute all the fields
in it - merely opening it would not, I think, cause the problem you describe
in this case. But as soon as you Print Preview, for example, everything is
updated, including that { Title Subject } field, even though you have no
page 2 in section 1, and even if you never had one.
e. You end up with "Subject" in the Title property.

That occurs in Mac Word 2004, WinWord 2003 and 2007 and I would guess it's
the same in most earlier versions.

Peter Jamieson

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Peter:

Damn straight it's not well known. I suspect you are the only person in the
known universe who knew that one!!

Many thanks {files away securely...}

Cheers

a. you create a document and start by putting {the fields { Title } {
Subject } in the header. Except by mistake, you put { Title Subject }. I
suspect it's not well-known that such a field will update the title when
executed.
b. you change the layout so it's "different first page". However, the
header you entered is the standard "Header", so it now disappears from page
1, which now has the "First Page Header"
c. You change the title to mytitle, then save and close the document
d. You re-open the document, and one way or another, execute all the fields
in it - merely opening it would not, I think, cause the problem you describe
in this case. But as soon as you Print Preview, for example, everything is
updated, including that { Title Subject } field, even though you have no
page 2 in section 1, and even if you never had one.
e. You end up with "Subject" in the Title property.

That occurs in Mac Word 2004, WinWord 2003 and 2007 and I would guess it's
the same in most earlier versions.

Peter Jamieson

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[Peter Jamieson]

It actually dates back to Word 1 (on Windows) - and even that behaviour
with the different first page is the same on that version.

Works for the 5 original built-in properties - Title, Subject, Author,
Keywords, Comments and the newer { INFO TITLE } versions, but not those
newfangled ones like Company that need a DOCPROPERTY to insert them.

In my experience, this feature is one of those things that looks as if it
ought to be useful, but when you get around to trying it, you realise that
it will probably increase confusion for the user n most cases. I suspect the
whole thing works better in 2007 with the content controls where a change in
one "title" is correctly replicated in all instances of "Title".

Peter Jamieson

 

[JE McGimpsey]

That occurs in Mac Word 2004, WinWord 2003 and 2007 and I would guess it's
the same in most earlier versions.

Oh, I can think of a NUMBER of uses for this...!!