Does Microsoft fix the Office 2007 nasty GUI issue?

[Sults]

Is there any chance, that MS restores the good old flexible GUI for MS Office
or at least adds an opportunity for users to switch back to the old GUI?
The new ribbon system is ugly, space wasting, inflexible and
counterproductive. I would be glad if an option for using Office 2003 like
menu and toolbox system instead of the new ribbon crap would be created.

The new ribbon system is maybe good for beginners, but it is bad for
professionals who like to optimize the GUI for performance. I want, that all
my most used command would be accessible by single click and the state of all
important combo choices would be visible all the time. I want to decide
myself what buttons should be big, what buttons small and what buttons not
visible at all.
I need that:
1. It was possible to create multiple button bars that can be placed in
compact way in single row or in multiple rows. Compared with the old, Office
2003 system, it was even better, if there was possible to use at least 2
different sizes for buttons simultaneously (normal and large (double) size,
maybe small (half) size too).
2. It was possible to switch those button bars on or off (individually),
change order of the buttons and bars. The ribbon system only lets to hide all
the ribbon together or nothing.
3. There was an option to switch individually off menu and label rows to
free some space for document area. The ribbon system wastes multiple rows for
a) tab labels above the buttons and b) button blocks labels under the buttons
(just a waste of space!), c) duplicate button labels (pictogram and text,
another waste!).
4. There were flexible options for designing and placing buttons for user
macros. The ribbon system does not let create reasonable amount of macro
buttons at all!

I have bought hundreds of Microsoft licenses for myself and my companies,
but I will switch to the alternatives if MS will not fix crappy and
inflexible interface issues of Office 2007. As a long time MS office user I
saw no reason to test every new Office software version before buy. I thought
until the recent version that MS Office is superior compared with
alternatives. It is still, if to compare everything else but the GUI. But the
good old GUI has been destroyed completely and was degraded into limited
interface for complete morons. I suggest, that if MS creates some special
version for idiots, like the Office 2007 ribbon system seems to be, then the
version should be labelled so that the label reflects the target group and
loyal customers can avoid buying the crap.

 

[Alias]

Is there any chance, that MS restores the good old flexible GUI for MS Office
or at least adds an opportunity for users to switch back to the old GUI?
The new ribbon system is ugly, space wasting, inflexible and
counterproductive. I would be glad if an option for using Office 2003 like
menu and toolbox system instead of the new ribbon crap would be created.

The new ribbon system is maybe good for beginners, but it is bad for
professionals who like to optimize the GUI for performance. I want, that all
my most used command would be accessible by single click and the state of all
important combo choices would be visible all the time. I want to decide
myself what buttons should be big, what buttons small and what buttons not
visible at all.
I need that:
1. It was possible to create multiple button bars that can be placed in
compact way in single row or in multiple rows. Compared with the old, Office
2003 system, it was even better, if there was possible to use at least 2
different sizes for buttons simultaneously (normal and large (double) size,
maybe small (half) size too).
2. It was possible to switch those button bars on or off (individually),
change order of the buttons and bars. The ribbon system only lets to hide all
the ribbon together or nothing.
3. There was an option to switch individually off menu and label rows to
free some space for document area. The ribbon system wastes multiple rows for
a) tab labels above the buttons and b) button blocks labels under the buttons
(just a waste of space!), c) duplicate button labels (pictogram and text,
another waste!).
4. There were flexible options for designing and placing buttons for user
macros. The ribbon system does not let create reasonable amount of macro
buttons at all!

I have bought hundreds of Microsoft licenses for myself and my companies,
but I will switch to the alternatives if MS will not fix crappy and
inflexible interface issues of Office 2007. As a long time MS office user I
saw no reason to test every new Office software version before buy. I thought
until the recent version that MS Office is superior compared with
alternatives. It is still, if to compare everything else but the GUI. But the
good old GUI has been destroyed completely and was degraded into limited
interface for complete morons. I suggest, that if MS creates some special
version for idiots, like the Office 2007 ribbon system seems to be, then the
version should be labelled so that the label reflects the target group and
loyal customers can avoid buying the crap.

If you like the new ribbon in Office, you'll love it in Windows 7.

Alias

 

[Sults]

If you like the new ribbon in Office, you'll love it in Windows 7.

Alias

I do not recall, that some Windows OS version has customizable menu and
button bar systems. I think, that this is the reason why I do not miss it.
But MS Offices up to Office 2003 had flexible menu and button system that is
essential for productive work. It is so sad, that Microsoft decided to
replace this good old system with the ribbon crap.

Microsofts attempts to make OS interface unusable do not bother me so far,
because even Vista runs my applications quite well. If Windows 7 will be
unusable, then I will just avoid it. I have always tried new operating
systems somewhere else, before buying, and will do this also in the future.

 

[Gordon]

Is there any chance, that MS restores the good old flexible GUI for MS
Office
or at least adds an opportunity for users to switch back to the old GUI?
The new ribbon system is ugly, space wasting,

Then minimize it.

inflexible

And the ability to customize to the nth degree is a corporate support
NIGHTMARE.

and counterproductive.

Not at all. yes there is a learning curve as to what occurs where, but that
happens with ANY new release of any application.

I would be glad if an option for using Office 2003 like
menu and toolbox system instead of the new ribbon crap would be created.

Why not just LEARN it? I bet in the amount of time you are complaining about
it, you could actually LEARN a good deal.

The new ribbon system is maybe good for beginners, but it is bad for
professionals who like to optimize the GUI for performance.

As a "professional" for at least 20 years, having used Office sinve version
95, I have NEVER needed to do any "optimizing" at all.
As a recently-retired Systems Accountant I can tell you that the VAST
majority of Users use a SMALL number of commands frequently because they
only deal with a small number of types of document.

I want, that all my most used command would be accessible by single click

Then add them to the QAT - that's what it's there for. See my comment above
about LEARNING.

and the state of all important combo choices would be visible all the
time. I want to decide
myself what buttons should be big, what buttons small and what buttons not
visible at all.

Then I suggest you write your own suite - I don't recall being able to alter
the size of individual bittons on ANY suite....

I need that:
1. It was possible to create multiple button bars that can be placed in
compact way in single row or in multiple rows. Compared with the old,
Office
2003 system, it was even better, if there was possible to use at least 2
different sizes for buttons simultaneously (normal and large (double)
size,
maybe small (half) size too).

And when has ANY Office suite done that?

I have bought hundreds of Microsoft licenses for myself and my companies,
but I will switch to the alternatives if MS will not fix crappy and
inflexible interface issues of Office 2007.

SO WHY DID YOU BUY IT?
Petard and Hoist come to mind........

 

[Sults]

Then minimize it.

Minimizing is not an option, because I still need to pass commands to the
software.
I think, that flexible system, that lets you to choose all necessary
commands and hide unnecessary ones is superior to the system, that only lets
to use set of predefined commands or nothing.

And the ability to customize to the nth degree is a corporate support
NIGHTMARE.

I was responsible for IT support of nationwide governmental office 10 years,
but I have never met this problem!

Not at all. yes there is a learning curve as to what occurs where, but that
happens with ANY new release of any application.

If you start to talk about learning curve, then you clearly give me a
signal, that you do not have a glue, where the ribbon systems problem lies.
The ribbon system forces users to do many extra clicks and surfing in the
menus. That wastes time. Ribbon system wastes also screen space. This again
wastes time.

Why not just LEARN it? I bet in the amount of time you are complaining about
it, you could actually LEARN a good deal.

Then you will loose your bet! You are just so wrong!

As a "professional" for at least 20 years, having used Office sinve version
95, I have NEVER needed to do any "optimizing" at all.
As a recently-retired Systems Accountant I can tell you that the VAST
majority of Users use a SMALL number of commands frequently because they
only deal with a small number of types of document.

I use MS office since 1994, it was MS Office 4.0 then, when I started to use
it. If you never optimized your button bars so far, then you are definitely
dumb user and can not even imagine what was the full potentiol of the old GUI.
I agree, that most users, even me, use only small number of commands most of
time. But the ribbon system lacks ability to collect most used commandas into
some compact button bars, to be able to access those commands directly with a
single click.

Then add them to the QAT - that's what it's there for. See my comment above
about LEARNING.

The QAT is a pale shadow of the old system. It is so limited, that does not
help. If there was possible to vreate many QAT-s and place those freely, it
could solve the problem.

Then I suggest you write your own suite - I don't recall being able to alter
the size of individual bittons on ANY suite....

That was my suggestion for Microsoft to bring in some useful novelty.

And when has ANY Office suite done that?

As i said above, that was my suggestion for Microsoft to bring in some
useful novelty.

SO WHY DID YOU BUY IT?
Petard and Hoist come to mind........

I bought it for many reasons:
a) because I bought a new computer and needed a software there.
b) I liked old Offices very much and had no idea, that the newest one is
such a nightmare
c) the old versions are not available in the market any more
d) some of my clients switched to the new version and started to send me
documents using new formats
e) as I provide some IT support even now, I thought that buying a new
version would be a good investment, because then I can provide help for my
customers, who might have some troubles with some new features of the software
f) etc

 

[Harlan Grove]

Then minimize it.

In which case how does the ribbon make anything more visible than
classic menus?

And the ability to customize to the nth degree is a corporate support
NIGHTMARE.

So ribbon fine in a corporate setting, but why not let users who buy
Office on their own have the flixibility to customize to the nth
degree? Office 2007 is still subject to group policy isn't it? So
group policy settings could be used to freeze the UI in corporate/
administered contexts while allowing former levels of customization in
individual/unadministered contexts, no?

But in your mind eliminating flexibility in one context justifies
eliminating it in all contexts?

Not at all. yes there is a learning curve as to what occurs where, but that
happens with ANY new release of any application.

Really? I don't recall any loss of productivity from Excel 2002 to
Excel 2003, Excel 2000 to Excel 2002, Excel 97 to Excel 2000, Excel 5
to Excel 97, even from Excel 4 to Excel 5 since Microsoft provided an
Excel 4 menu in Excel 5. How odd they didn't think of doing that this
time. Gives one the impression MSFT developed the ribbon for little
other reason than giving Office a UI none of their direct competitors
could use, thus making it more difficult for Office users to switch to
anything else.

Why not just LEARN it? I bet in the amount of time you are complaining about
it, you could actually LEARN a good deal.

By the exact same logic, one could say to immigrants into any country
'Learn our language. Until you do, you get no public services. Life
will be easier for you when you've done so.'

As a "professional" for at least 20 years, having used Office sinve version
95, I have NEVER needed to do any "optimizing" at all.
As a recently-retired Systems Accountant I can tell you that the VAST
majority of Users use a SMALL number of commands frequently because they
only deal with a small number of types of document.

You've only been using it since Office 95? I used Excel 2.x under
Windows/386 (effectively version 2) back in the late 1980s. I was
using Excel when MSFT made the last great menu change between Excel 4
and Excel 5. Back then they had the sense to provide an Excel 4 menu
in Excel 5. Back then they also had effective competition (Lotus 1-2-3
was still the spreadsheet market leader, though Word may have become
the word processing market leader, and Borland and WordPerfect
couldn't be ignored), so they couldn't afford to piss off the existing
customer base. Now they can.

As for the need to customize, I've used a moderately customized menu
and heavily customized toolbars and several toolbars of my own since
Excel 2000, so for over 8 years. The ribbon sucks.

I'd agree that most users use a small fraction of available commands.
Indeed, a single custom toolbar is all that's needed in most custom
Excel models. It's not MUCH MORE DIFFICULT to develop such Excel
models.

As for Word, since pages are usually in 'portrait mode', vertically
oriented toolbars are much handier than the horizontal only ribbon.
Why couldn't MSFT have provided a vertical ribbon option? Yeah, it
might have to scroll, but so does the current ribbon if you use Office
apps in unmaximized windows.

Then add them to the QAT - that's what it's there for. See my comment above
about LEARNING.

And you can ONLY have them in the QAT, and if the QAT grows big
enough, you lose the caption in the application window's title bar.
See my comments about vertically oriented ribbons. Even if there were
legitimate reasons to avoid vertically oriented ribbons, there's no
good argument against vertically oriented QATs, just MSFT's inability
to have considered it in design phase or their unwillingness to
implement it. Flexibility for users? Who needs it?!

Then I suggest you write your own suite - I don't recall being able to alter
the size of individual bittons on ANY suite....

....

Button size? No.

Using some alternatives to Windows Explorer as the OS shell it's
possible to dock collections of buttons of different sizes onto
application windows and interact with the application via Automation.
It's a bit clumsy, and there's noticeable time lag.

 

[Gemini]

LOL, sults! I understand your pain.

MS has no plans to provide a classic UI alternative to the Ribbon. They've
invested heavily in the Ribbon and are doing their best to shove it down
users' throats. Given that, you have a choice of reverting to Office 2003
(that's the option I selected) or to buy third party add-ins. The latter add
another tab to the Ribbon containing the classic UI option. I had tried this
too. However, per my recollection, not all keyboard shortcuts work as
expected.

You may want to check if there's a refund policy wherever you're located. I
recall that there's one available in the US market.

You may also want to let MS know about your opinion. You can do so from
their website (the Office section).

Of course, expect to hear from the Ribbon fans how wonderful the Ribbon is,
blah, blah, blah. Some will even claim that the Ribbon is successful. Of
course, they can't cite any data to back up their claims.

Be warned that MS plans to use the Ribbon UI extensively in upcoming Windows
versions.

Oh yes, Jensen Harris led the design team that produced the ridiculous
Ribbon. Here's a link to his blog, where he pontificates about the Ribbon.
You can send him an email from there as well. He's been claiming that the
Ribbon is highly successful.
http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/

Perhaps there are still some people at MS who actually care what long
term/power users want when it comes to the UI.

hth!

-- Gemini

 

[Gemini]

Gordon, haven't you got anything better to do than to post useless responses
to those who do not like the Ribbon? I refer to your oft-repeated (and
useless) comment "Why not just learn it?". Power users largely have found the
Ribbon to be a waste of time, space and a productivity killer. That's a fact.

BTW, you've posted about how long you've used Office. That does not make you
a power user. Of course, by your own admission, you had never heard of the
term "power user" until you read it in one of my earlier posts. You may have
used only a small subset of the available functions. That doesn't hold true
for all other users, esp. the power users. Extrapolating your own experience
is a ridiculous, futile exercise.

Oh yes, do try reading the OP's post thoroughly (slowly and several times,
if need be) BEFORE penning your response. The OP clearly stated that he did
not check out Office 2007 because he did not expect such a ridiculous UI.
He's not the first in that situation. Your silly response doesn't help the OP
any.

-- Gemini

 

[Alias]

Perhaps there are still some people at MS who actually care what long
term/power users want when it comes to the UI.

LOL! Now *that's* funny!

Alias

 

[Gemini]

<G> Hey! Hope springs eternal .... <G>

-- Gemini