Double Spacing problem (not paragraph spacing)

[cchoi]

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Hello all,

My problem concerns the line spacing of Word 2008. My paragraph spacing is set to 0 pt. That is not the problem. However, the line spacing when double spaced is simply bigger than that of previous Word versions. When I compare double spacing and # of lines to a page, this version of Word appears to have at least 3 fewer lines. This is a bit of a problem since I'm looking to submit my undergraduate honors thesis soon.

 

[CyberTaz]

Although it provides the settings for the user to control line spacing Word
doesn't vary it on its own from one version to another. "Line Spacing",
however, is a variable based on font size, so "single" or "double" for 12 pt
type will be more than "single" or "double" would be for 10 pt & less than
it would be for 14 pt. Further, line spacing is built into the design of the
font, so it's possible that single/double/etc. could vary from one font to
another even for the same font size. [The norm for single is 120% of the
font size but that's what can vary at the discretion of the designer.]

The question remains, though, is there a real difference in the number of
lines/page or is it that it "appears to have at least 3 fewer lines"? If
there actually are fewer lines/page there are most likely some formatting
issues that accounts for it but other factors come into play - it may have
nothing to do with line or paragraph spacing... Not to mention that 3
lines/page is a significant difference. [I.E., With 12 pt Times New Roman
single spaced is 14.4 pts, so dbl would be 28.8 & in order to get 3 fewer
lines/page I have to increase the line spacing nearly another 5 pts.]

One possibility is the printer driver - make sure you have the most current
update from the mfr's web site.

Another possibility is variation if the font itself. If the document was
created using one [older] version of a font the variation could actually be
caused by variation in characters/line which causes the number of lines to
be different. Variation may also be caused by font substitution.

Bottom line is that if the number of lines/pg really is different it would
require a more through analysis to determine the cause. Examine all aspects
of the document formatting & layout including the Styles used in the doc.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Clive Huggan]

Separately from CyberTaz's excellent suggestions: I note the comment

This is a bit of a problem since I'm looking to submit
my undergraduate honors thesis soon.

That doesn't mean you have put hard page breaks on each page, does it? If
you are formatting your thesis that way, make life much easier for yourself
by getting rid of them and producing the document with "minimum maintenance"
formatting. For details, see page 146 of some notes on the way I use Word
for the Mac, titled "Bend Word to Your Will", which are available as a free
download from the Word MVPs' website
(http://word.mvps.org/Mac/Bend/BendWordToYourWill.html).

[Note: "Bend Word to your will" is designed to be used electronically and
most subjects are self-contained dictionary-style entries. If you decide to
read more widely than the item I've referred to, it's important to read the
front end of the document -- especially pages 3 and 5 -- so you can select
some Word settings that will allow you to use the document effectively.]

Cheers,

Clive Huggan
Canberra, Australia
(My time zone is 5-11 hours different from the Americas and Europe, so my
follow-on responses to those regions can be delayed)
====================================================

Although it provides the settings for the user to control line spacing Word
doesn't vary it on its own from one version to another. "Line Spacing",
however, is a variable based on font size, so "single" or "double" for 12 pt
type will be more than "single" or "double" would be for 10 pt & less than
it would be for 14 pt. Further, line spacing is built into the design of the
font, so it's possible that single/double/etc. could vary from one font to
another even for the same font size. [The norm for single is 120% of the
font size but that's what can vary at the discretion of the designer.]

The question remains, though, is there a real difference in the number of
lines/page or is it that it "appears to have at least 3 fewer lines"? If
there actually are fewer lines/page there are most likely some formatting
issues that accounts for it but other factors come into play - it may have
nothing to do with line or paragraph spacing... Not to mention that 3
lines/page is a significant difference. [I.E., With 12 pt Times New Roman
single spaced is 14.4 pts, so dbl would be 28.8 & in order to get 3 fewer
lines/page I have to increase the line spacing nearly another 5 pts.]

One possibility is the printer driver - make sure you have the most current
update from the mfr's web site.

Another possibility is variation if the font itself. If the document was
created using one [older] version of a font the variation could actually be
caused by variation in characters/line which causes the number of lines to
be different. Variation may also be caused by font substitution.

Bottom line is that if the number of lines/pg really is different it would
require a more through analysis to determine the cause. Examine all aspects
of the document formatting & layout including the Styles used in the doc.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Hello all,

My problem concerns the line spacing of Word 2008. My paragraph spacing is
set
to 0 pt. That is not the problem. However, the line spacing when double
spaced
is simply bigger than that of previous Word versions. When I compare double
spacing and # of lines to a page, this version of Word appears to have at
least 3 fewer lines. This is a bit of a problem since I'm looking to submit
my
undergraduate honors thesis soon.

 

[trishb]

I have been having the exact same problem! I have all the settings "correct" but new documents' double spacing is noticeably larger than older documents...even those created in Word 2008 a mere several months ago!

In fact, I copied some text from an older 2008 doc and pasted it into a new doc. The resulting text was spaced larger and was obviously more than double spaced. Strangely enough, when set at 1.5 spacing, it appeared the same as the older document.

I'm using Times New Roman, 12 point. It's set to 0 extra lines before and after. I've had to change the settings so that the spacing is at "exactly" 28.8 rather than "double".

It's a workaround for now, but what the heck is going on??

Although it provides the settings for the user to control line spacing Word
doesn't vary it on its own from one version to another. "Line Spacing",
however, is a variable based on font size, so "single" or "double" for 12 pt
type will be more than "single" or "double" would be for 10 pt & less than
it would be for 14 pt. Further, line spacing is built into the design of the
font, so it's possible that single/double/etc. could vary from one font to
another even for the same font size. [The norm for single is 120% of the
font size but that's what can vary at the discretion of the designer.]

The question remains, though, is there a real difference in the number of
lines/page or is it that it "appears to have at least 3 fewer lines"? If
there actually are fewer lines/page there are most likely some formatting
issues that accounts for it but other factors come into play - it may have
nothing to do with line or paragraph spacing... Not to mention that 3
lines/page is a significant difference. [I.E., With 12 pt Times New Roman
single spaced is 14.4 pts, so dbl would be 28.8 & in order to get 3 fewer
lines/page I have to increase the line spacing nearly another 5 pts.]

One possibility is the printer driver - make sure you have the most current
update from the mfr's web site.

Another possibility is variation if the font itself. If the document was
created using one [older] version of a font the variation could actually be
caused by variation in characters/line which causes the number of lines to
be different. Variation may also be caused by font substitution.

Bottom line is that if the number of lines/pg really is different it would
require a more through analysis to determine the cause. Examine all aspects
of the document formatting & layout including the Styles used in the doc.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Hello all,

My problem concerns the line spacing of Word 2008. My paragraph spacing is set
to 0 pt. That is not the problem. However, the line spacing when double spaced
is simply bigger than that of previous Word versions. When I compare double
spacing and # of lines to a page, this version of Word appears to have at
least 3 fewer lines. This is a bit of a problem since I'm looking to submit my
undergraduate honors thesis soon.

 

[John McGhie]

The first release of Word 2008 set a default spacing of 10 points after on
the Normal paragraph style (which is the way the professionals operate).

Subsequent releases (and WinWord) set 0 points before and after.

If you have not replaced your Normal template since the first installation,
you are probably stuck with the old measure. Delete the Normal template to
pick up the new default in new documents.

Of course, any documents created before you do this will have the old
spacing. You will need to manually correct the styles in those.

The other issue you will be running into is that Word draws its measurements
from the printer connected as the default. If you are using a different
model of printer from the other people, you will get a difference in
pagination, which would amount to about three lines over the length of an A4
sheet.

Note that the line height for 12 point type is 14 points (to allow for the
bits of the letter that go above and below the font height).

So 2 x 14 points is 28 points, which is about a third of a line larger than
you might be expecting.

Generally, we advise people not to try to make a page justify to exactly the
same measure on two different computers, because there is such a wide range
of variables you need to cope with, and life is too short. Word is designed
to lay the page out neatly and professionally using the optimum settings a
print professional would use when laying up a page. We normally advise
people to simply stand back and let it do what it is designed to do.

A documentation professional will set a large number of things to ensure
that when Word lays out the page, the result is what they want. I could go
on to describe them all, but somehow, I sense you're a little too busy to do
all of that

If you do want to learn it all, just post back and we'll explain it all: you
need to spend about a month learning about styles and paragraph properties
and layout, and after that, Word will be like putty in your hands.

Cheers

I have been having the exact same problem! I have all the settings "correct"
but new documents' double spacing is noticeably larger than older
documents...even those created in Word 2008 a mere several months ago!

In fact, I copied some text from an older 2008 doc and pasted it into a new
doc. The resulting text was spaced larger and was obviously more than double
spaced. Strangely enough, when set at 1.5 spacing, it appeared the same as the
older document.

I'm using Times New Roman, 12 point. It's set to 0 extra lines before and
after. I've had to change the settings so that the spacing is at "exactly"
28.8 rather than "double".

It's a workaround for now, but what the heck is going on??

Although it provides the settings for the user to control line spacing Word
doesn't vary it on its own from one version to another. "Line Spacing",
however, is a variable based on font size, so "single" or "double" for 12 pt
type will be more than "single" or "double" would be for 10 pt & less than
it would be for 14 pt. Further, line spacing is built into the design of the
font, so it's possible that single/double/etc. could vary from one font to
another even for the same font size. [The norm for single is 120% of the
font size but that's what can vary at the discretion of the designer.]

The question remains, though, is there a real difference in the number of
lines/page or is it that it "appears to have at least 3 fewer lines"? If
there actually are fewer lines/page there are most likely some formatting
issues that accounts for it but other factors come into play - it may have
nothing to do with line or paragraph spacing... Not to mention that 3
lines/page is a significant difference. [I.E., With 12 pt Times New Roman
single spaced is 14.4 pts, so dbl would be 28.8 & in order to get 3 fewer
lines/page I have to increase the line spacing nearly another 5 pts.]

One possibility is the printer driver - make sure you have the most current
update from the mfr's web site.

Another possibility is variation if the font itself. If the document was
created using one [older] version of a font the variation could actually be
caused by variation in characters/line which causes the number of lines to
be different. Variation may also be caused by font substitution.

Bottom line is that if the number of lines/pg really is different it would
require a more through analysis to determine the cause. Examine all aspects
of the document formatting & layout including the Styles used in the doc.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

Hello all,

My problem concerns the line spacing of Word 2008. My paragraph spacing is
set
to 0 pt. That is not the problem. However, the line spacing when double
spaced
is simply bigger than that of previous Word versions. When I compare double
spacing and # of lines to a page, this version of Word appears to have at
least 3 fewer lines. This is a bit of a problem since I'm looking to submit
my
undergraduate honors thesis soon.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Sydney, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[CyberTaz]

If you've actually done what you describe I'd strongly recommend that you
trash the Normal template you now have on your Mac. Make sure Word isn't
running, remove that file, then launch Word & let it build a new
Normal.dotm.

For one thing, Word 2003 does not use a file by the name of "Normal.dotm",
which is the name of the template used by Word 2007/8. Prior versions on the
PC use a file called Normal.dot whereas prior versions on the Mac use Normal
[without any extension] - but it is a *name* only. Because of the
differences in the respective application coding & the differences in the
respective OS for which they were designed, however, they are *not* the same
file. The Normal template should not even be moved from one installation of
the same version to another, let alone cross-platform.

If you need to have that level of consistency, modify the Normal.dotm
generated by Mac Word 2008. As described in an earlier post on the subject
the reason for the different number of lines on a page can be caused by any
number/combination of reasons - including the difference in printer drivers
on the systems involved. I'm fairly certain that the 23/18 difference is
actually something MS did on the PC side & has since revised... They
arbitrarily took it upon themselves to set default "single spacing" to 1.15
lines rather than 1 line.

Also keep in mind that changing the specs of the template will have no
effect or influence on existing documents. When a document is created its
default specs are set based on what the template being used is set to at the
time. It is spun off as a separate document, however, and is not reliant on
the template from then on.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Jeff Wiseman]

Just a thought here. Would the default document formatting
setting for the vertical alignment possibly have changed from Top
to Justified?

If Justified is used then the document is going to feather out
and if you barely have enough lines to fill the page, you're not
going to get as many lines on the page because of the verticle
stretching.

This default may be stored in Normal.

 

[CyberTaz]

Conceivable, Jeff, but Justified [verticaly] is a variable based on the
number of lines on the page - the fewer lines typed the greater the spacing
between them. But AFAIK it doesn't limit the number of lines that can be on
a page. IOW, The more you type the tighter the lines become until the page
is filled up to the limit allowed by line spacing & other formatting.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Jeff Wiseman]

That's true, and if the original poster was comparing it on his
thesis, it is unlikely he would have noticed a problem.

But if he was just experimenting to see how many lines it took to
fill a page, I figured that he would see the behavior as a
difference (i.e., only one page entered to compare with)

Conceivable, Jeff, but Justified [verticaly] is a variable based on the
number of lines on the page - the fewer lines typed the greater the spacing
between them. But AFAIK it doesn't limit the number of lines that can be on
a page. IOW, The more you type the tighter the lines become until the page
is filled up to the limit allowed by line spacing & other formatting.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Just a thought here. Would the default document formatting
setting for the vertical alignment possibly have changed from Top
to Justified?

If Justified is used then the document is going to feather out
and if you barely have enough lines to fill the page, you're not
going to get as many lines on the page because of the verticle
stretching.

This default may be stored in Normal.