Fonts don't appear in Word 2008

[Ken W]

New Year greetings from the cold and foggy River Thames

A[nother?] wierdness in Word

New Mac running 10.5.6, Word 2008 12.1.4

I've activated ITC Garamond Std in Suitcase. This is Open Type, with 12
weights including Condensed and Bold Condensed.

It is the standard font for our restaurant [see below] so I MUST use it
- we have recently brought some of the design work in house.

All has been working fine in InDesign for various jobs, but now I want
to use it in Word.

But not all the weights can be seen - particularly not the Cn and BdCn

This is a serious issue for me, since these faces are key to our "look"

And I also want to use them in some business docs - for which Word is
the obvious app of choice - since the Cn and BdCn will be good for
tables and Garamond is such a classic, elegant font.

I've cleared the font caches. [A process which BTW has pretty much
decided me to go back to Font Xplorer, even though it now costs $39.]

I've re-installed the fonts from CD, after checking them with Font
Doctor. Even though that means I have lost some of my custom kerning.

Still no joy.

Any suggestions? Or is Word 08 just soooo hoooked on its own themes and
funny fonts etc that it can't cope with individuals who want to do
their own thing?

And incidentally how do I remove Calibri and Cambria from the font
menu. I never use them, never want to use them, and threw them out the
day after upgrading to Office 08.

All contribs grat rec.

Ken


Restaurant Ship Hispaniola in London - on the Embankment. See
http://hispaniola.co.uk/

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Ken:

Right now, there is a bug in Office 2008's handling of Open Type fonts. It
gets confused and thinks it has already loaded some faces of some Open Type
fonts, so it doesn't load them when it really sees them.

The only work-around is to disable other fonts that you don't use, then
re-boot, until the needed faces appear.

The issue is not "the number of fonts you have loaded", it's a problem with
the handling of the name of the font face, which makes Office think it has
already loaded them.

They may put out a patch to cure this issue, but I have no idea when.

Calibri and Cambria will go away if you remove ALL instances of it from your
system There are five folders that potentially contain it: have a hunt

Note that the "Names" of these fonts will continue to appear in documents
where they have been used, after you have removed them from the system.
When you remove them, Word will temporarily substitute the closest remaining
match, but it will keep the names of the fonts so that it can switch them
back in on a system that has them installed. You can use the Font
Substitution button in the Compatibility Preferences to make the
substitution permanent (and lose the names...) if you wish. This needs to
be done for each affected document.

Note that all of the new templates use these fonts by default, so you will
be down-grading the templates by doing this. You may wish to have another
look at them: they are very nice looking fonts (And they contain a much
wider range of Unicode glyphs than most fonts do...)

Hope this helps

New Year greetings from the cold and foggy River Thames

A[nother?] wierdness in Word

New Mac running 10.5.6, Word 2008 12.1.4

I've activated ITC Garamond Std in Suitcase. This is Open Type, with 12
weights including Condensed and Bold Condensed.

It is the standard font for our restaurant [see below] so I MUST use it
- we have recently brought some of the design work in house.

All has been working fine in InDesign for various jobs, but now I want
to use it in Word.

But not all the weights can be seen - particularly not the Cn and BdCn

This is a serious issue for me, since these faces are key to our "look"

And I also want to use them in some business docs - for which Word is
the obvious app of choice - since the Cn and BdCn will be good for
tables and Garamond is such a classic, elegant font.

I've cleared the font caches. [A process which BTW has pretty much
decided me to go back to Font Xplorer, even though it now costs $39.]

I've re-installed the fonts from CD, after checking them with Font
Doctor. Even though that means I have lost some of my custom kerning.

Still no joy.

Any suggestions? Or is Word 08 just soooo hoooked on its own themes and
funny fonts etc that it can't cope with individuals who want to do
their own thing?

And incidentally how do I remove Calibri and Cambria from the font
menu. I never use them, never want to use them, and threw them out the
day after upgrading to Office 08.

All contribs grat rec.

Ken


Restaurant Ship Hispaniola in London - on the Embankment. See
http://hispaniola.co.uk/

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Sydney, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[Ken Welsby]

Thanks, John

I thought I had come up with a simple solution:

1 dump the complete family of ITC Garamond OT

2 open instead the "standard" weights / variants of Adobe Garamond Pro OT

3 load the PS versions of ITC Garamond Condensed [same 6 weights as the OT
versions previously loaded] which I've had for a while as part of a previous
package of fonts from Lino.

My theory being that this would eliminate confusion of names.

Well... It's a different, I can say that.

But maybe liveable with.

After step 3, I can see all the Adobe variants and FIVE out of SIX weights
of ITC Condensed.

The one that doesn't show up is ITC Garamond LT Light Condensed Italic.

However, if I select ITC Garamond LT Light Condensed, and then apply the
"Italic" button - something I drummed into the heads of hundreds of trainees
NEVER to do [at least, never to do in Quark XPress] - what appears looks
remarkably like the real Light Con Ital.

Somwhere I recall being able to see an info panel that specified if the B
and I buttons called the real faces, but I can't remember which app this
was. It isn't in Font Explorer, or at least can't immediately see it.

Does anyone know?

If this solution looks reasonably clean, I suspect I will live with it.

There are just two styles in the corporate report template which use this
typeface, both for info "sidebars" - except that they are at the bottom of
the page rather than the side, like DIY footnotes.

So if I create the styles using the I button, I won't often have to worry
about the curious case of the vanishing face.

Anything involving "serious typography" ­ signage, menus etc - is done in
InDesign anyway.

Let's just hope that a patch appears soon. I see on the Mactopia forum this
issue was being looked into nine months ago, so maybe soon ???

Thanks again

Ken

Hi Ken:

Right now, there is a bug in Office 2008's handling of Open Type fonts. It
gets confused and thinks it has already loaded some faces of some Open Type
fonts, so it doesn't load them when it really sees them.

The only work-around is to disable other fonts that you don't use, then
re-boot, until the needed faces appear.

The issue is not "the number of fonts you have loaded", it's a problem with
the handling of the name of the font face, which makes Office think it has
already loaded them.

They may put out a patch to cure this issue, but I have no idea when.

Calibri and Cambria will go away if you remove ALL instances of it from your
system There are five folders that potentially contain it: have a hunt

Note that the "Names" of these fonts will continue to appear in documents
where they have been used, after you have removed them from the system.
When you remove them, Word will temporarily substitute the closest remaining
match, but it will keep the names of the fonts so that it can switch them
back in on a system that has them installed. You can use the Font
Substitution button in the Compatibility Preferences to make the
substitution permanent (and lose the names...) if you wish. This needs to
be done for each affected document.

Note that all of the new templates use these fonts by default, so you will
be down-grading the templates by doing this. You may wish to have another
look at them: they are very nice looking fonts (And they contain a much
wider range of Unicode glyphs than most fonts do...)

Hope this helps

New Year greetings from the cold and foggy River Thames

A[nother?] wierdness in Word

New Mac running 10.5.6, Word 2008 12.1.4

I've activated ITC Garamond Std in Suitcase. This is Open Type, with 12
weights including Condensed and Bold Condensed.

It is the standard font for our restaurant [see below] so I MUST use it
- we have recently brought some of the design work in house.

All has been working fine in InDesign for various jobs, but now I want
to use it in Word.

But not all the weights can be seen - particularly not the Cn and BdCn

This is a serious issue for me, since these faces are key to our "look"

And I also want to use them in some business docs - for which Word is
the obvious app of choice - since the Cn and BdCn will be good for
tables and Garamond is such a classic, elegant font.

I've cleared the font caches. [A process which BTW has pretty much
decided me to go back to Font Xplorer, even though it now costs $39.]

I've re-installed the fonts from CD, after checking them with Font
Doctor. Even though that means I have lost some of my custom kerning.

Still no joy.

Any suggestions? Or is Word 08 just soooo hoooked on its own themes and
funny fonts etc that it can't cope with individuals who want to do
their own thing?

And incidentally how do I remove Calibri and Cambria from the font
menu. I never use them, never want to use them, and threw them out the
day after upgrading to Office 08.

All contribs grat rec.

Ken


Restaurant Ship Hispaniola in London - on the Embankment. See
http://hispaniola.co.uk/

 

[Elliott Roper]

Somwhere I recall being able to see an info panel that specified if the B
and I buttons called the real faces, but I can't remember which app this
was. It isn't in Font Explorer, or at least can't immediately see it.

Does anyone know?

With Garamond it is easy to test.
See what a lower case f looks like after hitting I
There is no way you could confuse slant and the real italic f is there?

Remember it is easy to manufacture matching styles in InDesign and
Word. Type in Word, do all the track changes games with your
collaborators, all the time telling them that the ransom note look will
be removed at the end of the process. Place the text into InDesign and
look for acceptable typography.

You are on a hiding to nothing expecting good typography from Word.

 

[Ken Welsby]

Thanks, Elliott

I think I may have misled you.

It was obvious as soon as I hit the I button that this odd workaround did
work, ie did call the correct font - letterforms such as f, g, h and w and
of course the serifs all confirm that it is ITC Garamond Condensed Italic
and not an electric slant.

Now I know this works with the PS fonts I shall try it with the OT - as a
matter of policy I am trying to standardise on OT so that in due course my
Windows colleague can obtain the matching fonts.

My query about the info panel showing if emboldening and italicising called
real faces or simply thickened / slanted in what used to be horrid Windows
fashion was by way of an aside. There are occasions when it would be
Useful to know in advance.

Essentially I'm using Word for reports, proposals and such like, where the
CondItal face is used in a couple of my standard styles - in certain types
of table and for info panels [a cross between sidebars and footnotes].

But you are absolutely right about not using Word for good typography -
that's what QXP, InDesign and Illustrator are for.

Which is why this bug was invisible to me for so long; I've been using
CondItal for signage, menus, print etc - using only InD and Illustrator.

But then I had a document with lots of long info panels, for which I decided
to change the style from regular Garamond Book Italic to Cond Italic - thus
exposing it for the first time to the vagaries of Word.

Thanks again

Ken

 

[Phillip Jones, CET]

Thanks, Elliott

I think I may have misled you.

It was obvious as soon as I hit the I button that this odd workaround did
work, ie did call the correct font - letterforms such as f, g, h and w and
of course the serifs all confirm that it is ITC Garamond Condensed Italic
and not an electric slant.

Now I know this works with the PS fonts I shall try it with the OT - as a
matter of policy I am trying to standardise on OT so that in due course my
Windows colleague can obtain the matching fonts.

My query about the info panel showing if emboldening and italicising called
real faces or simply thickened / slanted in what used to be horrid Windows
fashion was by way of an aside. There are occasions when it would be
Useful to know in advance.

Essentially I'm using Word for reports, proposals and such like, where the
CondItal face is used in a couple of my standard styles - in certain types
of table and for info panels [a cross between sidebars and footnotes].

But you are absolutely right about not using Word for good typography -
that's what QXP, InDesign and Illustrator are for.

Which is why this bug was invisible to me for so long; I've been using
CondItal for signage, menus, print etc - using only InD and Illustrator.

But then I had a document with lots of long info panels, for which I decided
to change the style from regular Garamond Book Italic to Cond Italic - thus
exposing it for the first time to the vagaries of Word.

Thanks again

Ken

With Garamond it is easy to test.
See what a lower case f looks like after hitting I
There is no way you could confuse slant and the real italic f is there?

Remember it is easy to manufacture matching styles in InDesign and
Word. Type in Word, do all the track changes games with your
collaborators, all the time telling them that the ransom note look will
be removed at the end of the process. Place the text into InDesign and
look for acceptable typography.

You are on a hiding to nothing expecting good typography from Word.

I've found that Word2008 doesn't handle Fonts near as well as word 2004.

I've recently bought ITC Benguait and it has different 6 different font styles.

All show up in word2004. In 2008 it appear some are combined and you get to the
different weights by using Bold, Italic buttons which wrong . Its a bug, but
Microsoft will never admit it.

By the way the differences are shown in a Thread I started about fonts not showing
up in 2008, last month I even posted png images of the differences. We decided it
was nothing I could do anything about.
--

 

[CyberTaz]

Hello Elliott - I hoped you were still lurking about!

<snip>
1. Cybertaz:- that's what's wrong with your hanging about the hospital
analogy. It does not count the ones that are dead and buried.

<snip>

Aye, but neither do you any longer have to listen to their moaning ;-)

 

[Elliott Roper]

I've found that Word2008 doesn't handle Fonts near as well as word 2004.

That's what's known as faint praise indeed!

I've recently bought ITC Benguait and it has different 6 different font
styles.

All show up in word2004. In 2008 it appear some are combined and you get to
the
different weights by using Bold, Italic buttons which wrong . Its a bug, but
Microsoft will never admit it.

By the way the differences are shown in a Thread I started about fonts not showing
up in 2008, last month I even posted png images of the differences. We decided it
was nothing I could do anything about.

Yep, you can junk Word.
I gave up, and I handed in my MVP badge. There was no way I wanted to
be seen supporting Word 2008. [1]

I've been test driving iWork '09
It is a beautiful lesson in how to make a telly-tubby word processor. I
assumed that was a design goal of Office 2008. Apple have just rubbed
Microsoft's nose in it.

If MS want to stay in the Office business, they have to make up their
mind whether they are in the professional WP market or making brightly
coloured plastic toys.

1. Cybertaz:- that's what's wrong with your hanging about the hospital
analogy. It does not count the ones that are dead and buried.

 

[Phillip Jones, CET]

Its not moaning. I like 2008 I use 2008. But facts, is facts. 2008 just doesn't
handle Fonts as well.

I'm not going to abandon 2008.

If you think Office 2008 is bad, try Acrobat 9 on a PowerPC machine to do forms. The
idea on paper is great, but the execution is terrible. Try living through a crash
every 2-1/ to 3 minutes when in Forms mode.

Hello Elliott - I hoped you were still lurking about!


<snip>

Aye, but neither do you any longer have to listen to their moaning ;-)

--