Graphic object vertical alignment shifts between Mac/Windows

[Dave]

For John McGhie:

I saw your very informed postings in this Google group and thought you
might know something about my problem. I have a Word form which uses a
series of tables with form fields in the cells. The various tables are
separated by only a paragraph return character. The top row (one cell)
of each table has a graphic object anchored to it as a design element.
These objects are the same size as the table cells/rows. The formatting
options chosen are behind text, centered in column, absolute position 0
below paragraph. Objects are set to move with text, anchors are not
locked (because the entire table row appears either on one page or
another) and overlap is allowed, though that doesn't come into play.

When viewed on a Windows machine, everything looks fine. The graphic
objects perfectly align with their rows. (The document was created on a
PC, if that matters, which it shouldn't.) But when opened on a Mac,
these objects can be misaligned. For objects at the top of a page,
aligment is perfect. As you move progressively down the page to other
tables, the objects get lower and lower relative to their row anchors.
If the problem is fixed on the Mac, the objects appear high when viewed
once again on a PC.

If the row and accompanying object happen to move to the next page
because a previous table grows, the position of the object is restored
to normal. To make things more interesting, I've determined that it
isn't the page position itself, but the number of other objects
appearing above the offending object on that page that controls how far
below the correct position any given object appears. So if there is a
long table filling most of the page, followed by another table, the
second table's object is only slightly out of position, even though
it's low on the page. If there are several short tables with associated
objects, however, the lower ones can be quite far out of position.
Again, if a particular table/row/object is bumped to the next page,
things appear in the correct position.

Any thoughts on why this happens or how to fix it would be appreciated.
Thank you.

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

Hi Dave:

Totally consistent with the way Word goes about its work.

The problem is that the printer driver, printer metrics, and font metrics
are slightly different between the Mac and the PC. You will always get
these small shifts because of that.

The cure would be to place the picture IN the table cell, not as a floating
item. Right-click the picture, choose Format Picture and set its Wrapping
style to Inline with Text.

Then drag or paste the picture INTO the table cell. If you paste, the table
will go strange on you: when that happens click the picture and set it back
to Inline With Text and the table will put itself back together again.

Cheers

For John McGhie:

I saw your very informed postings in this Google group and thought you
might know something about my problem. I have a Word form which uses a
series of tables with form fields in the cells. The various tables are
separated by only a paragraph return character. The top row (one cell)
of each table has a graphic object anchored to it as a design element.
These objects are the same size as the table cells/rows. The formatting
options chosen are behind text, centered in column, absolute position 0
below paragraph. Objects are set to move with text, anchors are not
locked (because the entire table row appears either on one page or
another) and overlap is allowed, though that doesn't come into play.

When viewed on a Windows machine, everything looks fine. The graphic
objects perfectly align with their rows. (The document was created on a
PC, if that matters, which it shouldn't.) But when opened on a Mac,
these objects can be misaligned. For objects at the top of a page,
aligment is perfect. As you move progressively down the page to other
tables, the objects get lower and lower relative to their row anchors.
If the problem is fixed on the Mac, the objects appear high when viewed
once again on a PC.

If the row and accompanying object happen to move to the next page
because a previous table grows, the position of the object is restored
to normal. To make things more interesting, I've determined that it
isn't the page position itself, but the number of other objects
appearing above the offending object on that page that controls how far
below the correct position any given object appears. So if there is a
long table filling most of the page, followed by another table, the
second table's object is only slightly out of position, even though
it's low on the page. If there are several short tables with associated
objects, however, the lower ones can be quite far out of position.
Again, if a particular table/row/object is bumped to the next page,
things appear in the correct position.

Any thoughts on why this happens or how to fix it would be appreciated.
Thank you.

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

 

[Dave]

John:

Thanks so much for the quick reply. Your fix works in some respects.
The graphics elements that gave me trouble were each composed of a
picture grouped with a text box. Word did not allow me to select In
line as a wrapping option. However, when I ungrouped and tried your fix
with only the picture portion, it worked perfectly.

For now, I've left the text boxes separate, anchored to the appropriate
cell rows. They still exhibit the same behavior as before, moving
downwards proportionally to the number of other text boxes above on the
page. Any thoughts how to fix that?

Thanks, Dave

 

[Dave]

Thanks again, John. You're right, of course. Creating all these little
picture objects is certainly tedious. But it seems to solve the Mac/PC
problem. And you're right about never asking someone else to do it.
It's maddening to have the boxes all resizing themselves constantly.
But it can eventually be done. Seems like something you'd do if you
were too cheap to buy a DTP program.

In my case, I'm trying to make a usable template for 150 field
consultants who only have Office on their laptops. No one else thought
about interplatform portability. I'm suggesting strongly that we simply
give up on the beautiful pictures and concentrate on a usable form. All
this effort hasn't added any functionality.

I'm surprised Word doesn't allow you to fill with gradients like
AppleWorks does. That's all these pictures are anyway.

So thanks for all your help.

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

It *is* something I do, and it *is* because I'm too cheap to buy a DTP
program

Word DOES allow you to fill with gradients -- which version of Word are you
using? In Word 2004:

1) Select the drawing object that can be filled (only Drawing Objects can
be filled)

2) Reveal the Formatting Palette

3) Under Colours, Weights and Fills click the drop-down arrow beside Colour

4) Choose Fill Effects...

And yes, pretty graphics rarely aid comprehension or information exchange
sufficiently to be worth the cost and effort of creating them. I've never
seen it add any functionality

Cheers

Thanks again, John. You're right, of course. Creating all these little
picture objects is certainly tedious. But it seems to solve the Mac/PC
problem. And you're right about never asking someone else to do it.
It's maddening to have the boxes all resizing themselves constantly.
But it can eventually be done. Seems like something you'd do if you
were too cheap to buy a DTP program.

In my case, I'm trying to make a usable template for 150 field
consultants who only have Office on their laptops. No one else thought
about interplatform portability. I'm suggesting strongly that we simply
give up on the beautiful pictures and concentrate on a usable form. All
this effort hasn't added any functionality.

I'm surprised Word doesn't allow you to fill with gradients like
AppleWorks does. That's all these pictures are anyway.

So thanks for all your help.

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

 

[Dave]

John, I used incorrect terminology. When I mentioned filling with
gradients, I should have said shading with gradients. What would solve
my problem is to be able to select the title cells in the tables, and
put in the desired eye candy by formatting in the borders and shading
window with a gradient rather than just a solid color. Now, if you know
how to do that, I'd really owe you a great debt.

 

[CyberTaz]

Hi Dave -

Have been following this thread with interest hoping to learn something new,
but basically it has confirmed my prior understanding. I make *no* attempt
to speak for John or to put words in his mouth, but one thing implied in his
responses but not specifically stated...

Word has no provision for filling a Table, Column. Row or Cell with a
gradient through the use of Format>Borders & Shading. The only options (I
have found) available are Solid colors or the Patterns in the Styles list of
that dialog box.

About the only way around it is to do as John suggests using a gradient
image, inserting it into the doc, then dragging it to the table cell. Since
it should be retained as InLine, however, it will not be possible to have
text overprint the gradient image - assuming you do want to use the gradient
as a background for text. If you change the Text Wrapping of the image to
Behind Text (or create a Rectangle shape & fill it with a gradient _or_
create a text box on top of the graphic), you wind up in the same 'floating
object' conundrum John so accurately & insightfully described.

You can, however, accomplish this in a page layout program such as
QuarkXPress or InDesign (I'm not sure about Publisher). Another possibility
is to create the table as a graphic file (again, using other software) and
inserting as a picture in Word.

Regards |:>)