Index format

K

KT 63

I am inserting an index into a document. I Want a “see also†subentry with
multiple titles and want NO page numbers. How do I do that? For example: I
would like the index entry to read:

Microsoft 5,22,34
See also: Word; Excel ; Power Point
 
C

Clive Huggan

Hello KT,

Congratulations! This is the first such question I recall seeing in the
Word newsgroups in the four years I've been associated with them.

I do it this way:

On pages 5, 22 and 34 I have the index entry { XE "Microsoft" } (note the
spaces, including 2 spaces after "XE").

On one of those pages (for convenient reference later I usually put it next
to the first entry, i.e. page 5 in this case):

{ XE "Microsoft, See also \t "Word; Excel; Power Point" \i }

That produces, in the index:

Microsoft, 5,22,34
Microsoft, See also. Word; Excel; PowerPoint <==last 3 words are italicized

(If you don't want the italics, leave out the \t)

A few explanations:

1. The reason I put "Microsoft" in the "see also" index entry is to
position this entry next to the one that shows the page numbers.

2. I manually delete "Microsoft, " thereby leaving the index reading:

Microsoft, 5,22,34
See also. Word; Excel; PowerPoint <==(last 3 words are italicized)

I then correct two other things:

3. I don't want the comma after "Microsoft" so I click at the start of the
index and initiate a Find [comma space] and Replace it with a space.

4. I don't want the full stop after "also" so I initiate a Find and Replace
to replace "also." with "also"

These take less time to fix than it took me to write this for you.

The index now reads:

Microsoft 5,22,34
See also Word; Excel; PowerPoint <==(last 3 words are italicized)

If you find indexing a pain (I do, but I have to do one per year on a
complex job with deadlines too tight to farm it out), you may be interested
in some other things I do to make things much easier and quicker:

I assign a paragraph style to index entries, which incorporates spacing
(leading), hidden text etc and a blue font colour (I have the index entries
as separate paragraphs, immediately above the paragraph in which the words
to be indexed appear, where I can easily see them and sort them -- the
colour makes this easier). (My indexing job often has many alternative
terms for the same concept, which do not appear in the text but only in the
index, because the document is subject to a high degree of parliamentary
scrutiny -- but for many people this does not apply and sorting here would
not be necessary.)

I assign a red font colour to the "see also" entries to distinguish them
from the ordinary index entries both in the main body of the document and in
the compiled index.

Before doing what's in the following paragraph I switch off "Smart quotes"
in Tools menu -> AutoCorrect -> AutoFormat as you type and switch off Smart
cut and paste (in Word 2004 it's Word menu -> Preferences -> Edit).

I have (on a separate doc, reduced to the smallest size possible and parked
in a convenient position), a sample of both types of paragraphs for index
entries, but without any terms in them. When in the main document I come to
where I need to have, say, a "see also" entry after I've been doing a few
ordinary index entries, I click on this document, select the "see also"
index entry paragraph, and copy it for pasting into the main document. Then
I select-Option-drag the word I want to index, from the main body text into
the index entry paragraph. It automatically becomes hidden text, blue etc
because the style takes over. Having switched off "smart cut and paste", a
space isn't formed -- spaces in the entries will index separately from those
without.

The colour in the index entries carries over to the compiled index, where
it's again easier to see the "see also" comment. I remove the colour after
the index has been compiled and shaken down.

Post back if you need any further info.

<Thinks> Must have a gin and tonic. Writing that was as bad as indexing!

Cheers,

Clive Huggan
Canberra, Australia
(My time zone is at least 5 hours different from the US and Europe, so my
follow-on responses to those regions can be delayed)
============================================================

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============================================================


On 19/3/05 1:49 PM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "KT 63" <KT
 
K

KT 63

WOW! Thanks for an incredible response, Clive. I think I'll have a martini too!

Ken Sanger
Sandpoint, Idaho
 
C

Clive Huggan

Thanks for your feedback, Ken!

On checking my post in the cold light of a Canberra autumn morning, I
<blush> find that in personalizing my index for your situation I omitted a
double quotation mark from the code for the "see also" index entry. It
should have been:

{ XE "Microsoft, See also " \t "Word; Excel; Power Point" \i }

I then made a very thorough check of my post and found a number of other
errors (I had wanted to get back to you promptly, but in hindsight I should
not have sent my response before doing a more thorough check, since it was
new material). Here they are:

Two spaces after XE are unnecessary (this error will have occurred aeons ago
via "Smart cut and paste").

It's necessary to select and italicize the last 3 words in the above example
if you want them to be italicized in the index.

My reference to the \t switch was wrong. This is the correct situation (look
up "Field codes: XE (Index Entry) field" in Help if you want more):

\t inserts the text in place of a page number.

\i makes the entry's page number italic, but because there is no page number
in these there is no reason to have \i in a "see also" entry.

You need to switch on dumb quotes before you type the index codes (so I
needed to say this at the beginning).

Finally, removing the comma between the last word in indexed terms and the
first page numbers, via the Search and Replace facility, has to be done
manually -- otherwise it will remove the commas between numbers.

I'm sorry for misleading you. This *does* typify what all of us find when
indexing: that it takes time to shake down the way it's done, albeit the
smooth operation afterwards is a compensation.

I have re-written the notes with these amendments in, below.

Thanks for asking this question -- it induced me to write up this topic,
which I hadn't done previously because I'm always so busy at the time of the
year when I do the huge once-a-year indexing job. Now I won't have to
re-learn everything!

I might put these notes eventually in "Bend Word to Your Will" (this is a
Word document containing notes on the way I use Word for the Mac, titled
"Bend Word to Your Will", which is available as a free download from the
Word MVPs' website (http://word.mvps.org/MacWordNew/Bend/BendWord.htm)).

Hmm, it's 9 hours too early for a gin and tonic. Maybe some orange juice...

Cheers,

Clive Huggan

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

QUESTION
I am inserting an index into a document. I Want a "see also" subentry with
multiple titles and want NO page numbers. How do I do that? For example: I
would like the index entry to read:

Microsoft 5, 22, 34
See also: Word; Excel; Power Point

ANSWER
Before doing what's in the following paragraphs I switch off "Smart quotes"
in Tools menu -> AutoCorrect -> AutoFormat as you type and switch off Smart
cut and paste (in Word 2004 it's Word menu -> Preferences -> Edit).

On pages 5, 22 and 34 I have the index entry { XE "Microsoft" } (note the
spaces).

On one of those pages (for convenient reference later I usually put it next
to the first entry, i.e. page 5 in this case) I put a "see also" index
entry:

{ XE "Microsoft, See also " \t "Word; Excel; Power Point" }

I select and italicize the last three words in this entry.

That produces, in the index:

Microsoft, 5,22,34
Microsoft, See also. Word; Excel; PowerPoint <==last 3 words are italicized

A few explanations:

1. The reason I put "Microsoft" in the "see also" index entry is to
position this entry next to the one that shows the page numbers.

2. I manually delete "Microsoft, " thereby leaving the index reading:

Microsoft, 5,22,34
See also. Word; Excel; PowerPoint

When I'm finally satisfied with the index that has been generated (which as
we all know will take a few iterations), I correct two other things:

3. I don't want the comma after "Microsoft", so I click at the start of the
index and initiate a Find for [comma space] and Replace it with a space
(don't click on "Replace all" or this will delete the commas between
numbers).

4. I don't want the full stop after "also" so I initiate a Find and Replace
to replace "also." with "also"

The index now reads:

Microsoft 5,22,34
See also Word; Excel; PowerPoint

If you find indexing a pain (I do, but I have to do one per year on a
complex job with deadlines too tight to farm it out), you may be interested
in some other things I do to make things much easier and quicker:

Having originally looked up "Create an index" in Help, and having gone to
the topic "Format index entries as you mark them", I found the procedure too
lengthy. So I decided to copy one index entry and to put it in its own
paragraph, placing it immediately above the paragraph in which the words to
be indexed appear, where I could easily see them and sort them. I copied
this paragraph for future use, thus avoiding the laborious procedure
described in Help.

I assigned a paragraph style for these paragraphs containing index entries,
which incorporates spacing (leading), hidden text etc, and a blue font
colour to makes it easier to see where an index entry is (and since my
indexing often has alternative terms for the same concept, which do not
appear in the text but only in the index, I often want to sort these entries
-- but many indexing tasks don't require this).

I assign a red font colour to the "see also" entries to distinguish them
from the ordinary index entries both in the main body of the document and in
the compiled index.

I paste into a separate new document -- that has been reduced to the
smallest size possible and parked in a convenient position -- a sample of
both types of paragraphs for index entries, but without any terms in them.
When in the main document I come to where I need to have, say, a "see also"
entry after I've been doing a few ordinary index entries, I click on this
document, select the "see also" index entry paragraph, and copy it. I then
paste it into the main document. Then I select and Option-drag the word I
want to index, from the main body text into this index entry paragraph. It
automatically becomes hidden text, blue etc because the style takes over.
Having switched off "smart cut and paste", a space isn't formed -- spaces in
the entries will index separately from those without.

The procedure in the preceding paragraph saves a huge amount of time in
indexing.

The colour in the index entries carries over to the compiled index, where
it's again easier to see the "see also" comment. I remove the colour after
the index has been compiled and shaken down.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 
K

KT 63

Thanks for the extras. I am creating an index for someone elses manuscript
with over 400 entries so I am using a concordance file. Using your
information, I found that I can enter the first column- computer - and into
the second column "\t "see also microsoft" and the entry in the index is -
computer see also Microsoft.

So I don't have to go through the document. I do, of course, have to clean
up the index since Word throws in the full stops (periods, in Yank land) and,
for each occurence of the searched for word, repeats teh "see also "
expression.

But thanks to your post, my task has been greatly simplified.

Maybe MS will read these posts and add some indexing features to Word.

Thanks again,
Ken
 
C

Clive Huggan

Thanks for the extras. I am creating an index for someone elses manuscript
with over 400 entries so I am using a concordance file. Using your
information, I found that I can enter the first column- computer - and into
the second column "\t "see also microsoft" and the entry in the index is -
computer see also Microsoft.

So I don't have to go through the document. I do, of course, have to clean
up the index since Word throws in the full stops (periods, in Yank land) and,
for each occurence of the searched for word, repeats teh "see also "
expression.

But thanks to your post, my task has been greatly simplified.

Maybe MS will read these posts and add some indexing features to Word.

Thanks again,
Ken

Good to know you got my second post, Ken, and to get your feedback on the
way you are handling it via a concordance file.

Cheers,

Clive
=====
 
P

PiMP Projects

KT 63 said:
Thanks for the extras. I am creating an index for someone elses manuscript
with over 400 entries so I am using a concordance file. Using your
information, I found that I can enter the first column- computer - and into
the second column "\t "see also microsoft" and the entry in the index is -
computer see also Microsoft.

So I don't have to go through the document. I do, of course, have to clean
up the index since Word throws in the full stops (periods, in Yank land) and,
for each occurence of the searched for word, repeats teh "see also "
expression.

But thanks to your post, my task has been greatly simplified.

Maybe MS will read these posts and add some indexing features to Word.

Thanks again,
Ken

~~~~~~~~~~~
Ken...

Using Word 2003, I tried - Costs - in the 1st column of the concordance table
and "\t "see also Budget" in the 2nd column...
but no success with the Auto Mark as the "Costs" component was missing from
the generated index and therefore no "anchor" for the text

I then tried... Costs" \t "see also Budget" in the 2nd column
but while this created the "Costs" anchor in the index, it also generated
multiple entries of "see also Budget" ?

Am I missing something basic in the use of Switches in a Concordance table ?
I am attempting to automate thru the table and not have to revert to manual
fine tuning.

Cheers

Roger (Oman)
 
J

John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]

I do so wish you people would stop trying to use Concordance files. They
simply DO NOT WORK for most indexing situations.

I know, I know... The Help recommends them. Well, sorry, but it's WRONG :)
For only 400 entries, it's far quicker to tag correctly and manually the
first time :)

Word has the best indexing tools I know of, even including the professional
indexing applications. It's just the best there is, period.

If you do not know this from your own experience, you may not have found
them all yet. Check this article:

http://word.mvps.org/faqs/formatting/Createindex.htm

That's one of the old articles affected by the Safari third frame bug: use
any other browser.

Cheers

~~~~~~~~~~~
Ken...

Using Word 2003, I tried - Costs - in the 1st column of the concordance table
and "\t "see also Budget" in the 2nd column...
but no success with the Auto Mark as the "Costs" component was missing from
the generated index and therefore no "anchor" for the text

I then tried... Costs" \t "see also Budget" in the 2nd column
but while this created the "Costs" anchor in the index, it also generated
multiple entries of "see also Budget" ?

Am I missing something basic in the use of Switches in a Concordance table ?
I am attempting to automate thru the table and not have to revert to manual
fine tuning.

Cheers

Roger (Oman)

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410
 
P

PiMP Projects

Thanks John...difficult to ignore advice from an expert
I am therefore in concordance to remove the concordance

Cheers

Roger (Oman)


John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macinto said:
I do so wish you people would stop trying to use Concordance files. They
simply DO NOT WORK for most indexing situations.

I know, I know... The Help recommends them. Well, sorry, but it's WRONG :)
For only 400 entries, it's far quicker to tag correctly and manually the
first time :)

Word has the best indexing tools I know of, even including the professional
indexing applications. It's just the best there is, period.

If you do not know this from your own experience, you may not have found
them all yet. Check this article:

http://word.mvps.org/faqs/formatting/Createindex.htm

That's one of the old articles affected by the Safari third frame bug: use
any other browser.

Cheers

~~~~~~~~~~~
Ken...

Using Word 2003, I tried - Costs - in the 1st column of the concordance table
and "\t "see also Budget" in the 2nd column...
but no success with the Auto Mark as the "Costs" component was missing from
the generated index and therefore no "anchor" for the text

I then tried... Costs" \t "see also Budget" in the 2nd column
but while this created the "Costs" anchor in the index, it also generated
multiple entries of "see also Budget" ?

Am I missing something basic in the use of Switches in a Concordance table ?
I am attempting to automate thru the table and not have to revert to manual
fine tuning.

Cheers

Roger (Oman)

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410
 
P

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