Is there someplace to report grammar checker errors?

[Three Lefts]

Word 2007 gives me a grammar error on this sentence:

I am meeting with the parents tomorrow afternoon.

None of these variations get errors:

I am meeting with the parents tomorrow.
I am meeting with the parents this afternoon.
I am meeting with the team tomorrow afternoon.

Assuming I don't have some setting wrong, isthere someplace that I can
report this?

I run into glitches like this all the time.

 

[Terry Farrell]

That's because all your examples are grammatically correct even though not
shinning examples of good sentence construction.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

That's not his point, Terry. His point is that the first example (which Word
marks as ungrammatical) is equally unexceptionable.

 

[Three Lefts]

That's because all your examples are grammatically correct even though not
shinning examples of good sentence construction.

Then why did it flag one and not the others?

Are you saying that the grammar checker flags sentences that are not
shinning [sic] examples as well as those with errors?

Perhaps, Dr. Farrell, you could educate me on what it is about those
sentences that fails your test for good sentence structure.

 

[Three Lefts]

That's not his point, Terry. His point is that the first example (which Word
marks as ungrammatical) is equally unexceptionable.

That was my tertiary point.

My primary point/question was whether there is someplace that users
can report glitches.

My secondary point had to do with whether this is a bug in the grammar
checker. In my opinion, it is.

Exhibit A: If I right click on the flagged word (parents), I am
offererd two alternative spellings: "parent's" and "parents'". If I
replace "parents" with either alternative,

I am meeting with the parent's tomorrow afternoon.
I am meeting with the parents' tomorrow afternoon.

Word is happy. These sentences are now gramatically incorrect ihn
addition to being non-shinning.

Exhibit B: If I right-click on the flagged word and choose About this
sentence, I get this:

Possessive Use
If you are using a singular noun to indicate possession, use an
apostrophe before the "s." If you are using a plural noun, use an
apostrophe after the "s."

Instead of: Both neighbors dogs barked all night long.
Consider: Both neighbors' dogs barked all night long.

Instead of: Ice hockey is Toms favorite sport.
Consider: Ice hockey is Tom's favorite sport.

Clearly Word has completely misunderstood the sentence. At least this
error message is consistent with the suggested spelling alternatives
-- consistently wrong.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Word is unable to recognize "tomorrow afternoon" as an adverbial
construction. Just one more example of why I don't bother with the grammar
checker.

 

[Three Lefts]

Word is unable to recognize "tomorrow afternoon" as an adverbial
construction. Just one more example of why I don't bother with the grammar
checker.

So it is a bug. Now maybe I can get an answer to my main question: Is
there someplace to send these bug reports?

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

If there were a place, you would have been told.

 

[Terry Farrell]

Suzanne

I miss understood that, but see clearly from the next post.

Terry

 

[Doug Robbins - Word MVP]

While I would not hold my breath waiting, the
microsoft.public.word.spelling.grammar newsgroups would be a more
appropriate newsgroup than this one. Very, very, very occasionally, there
is a Microsoft employee who provides responses in that group.

--
Hope this helps.

Please reply to the newsgroup unless you wish to avail yourself of my
services on a paid consulting basis.

Doug Robbins - Word MVP

 

[Beth Melton]

But even if a softie were to be there wouldn't something like this be pretty
low priority? I've always felt the grammar checker was designed to flag
areas that you need to scrutinize and wasn't intended to be infallible.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton

 

[Marsoupeal]

Word is unable to recognize "tomorrow afternoon" as an adverbial
construction. Just one more example of why I don't bother with the
grammar checker.

I don't know if you knew this, but for a long time in its early development
the UK dictionary accepted the spelling "liason."

 

[Terry Farrell]

It's almost impossible to be 'fallible' with English grammar because it is
too complex, has too many exceptions to rules; even scholars and reference
books disagree over many of the finer points, let alone simple points such
as the use of the comma. A perfect grammar checker would constantly dispute
it self. So it must be getting close

Terry Farrell

 

[Terry Farrell]

I remember telling Microsoft that for at least three Office betas before it
was finally corrected.

In Microsoft's defense, they do not manage the spelling or grammar
references: they are outsourced.

Terry Farrell

 

[Three Lefts]

It's almost impossible to be 'fallible' with English grammar because it is
too complex, has too many exceptions to rules; even scholars and reference
books disagree over many of the finer points, let alone simple points such
as the use of the comma. A perfect grammar checker would constantly dispute
it self. So it must be getting close

It's good you said "almost". A perfect grammar checker may be
impossible, but not for the reasons you cite. You remind me of the
Luddite professor I had in a computer science class way back in 1968.
He professed to the class that computers would never be able to
"think". As an example, he stated that computers would never be able
to play chess at the grand master level. He had the handicap of being
a member of a fundamentalist religion. I'm not sure what your problem
is.

In any case, this is all irrelevant to my original point. The sentence
the grammar checker flagged is perfectly correct even if it doesn't
measure up to your standards. Worse, it flags some sentences and not
other similar sentences. This is a bug in the grammar checker no
matter what the Microsoft apologists say. It's a bug.

 

[Three Lefts]

I remember telling Microsoft that for at least three Office betas before it
was finally corrected.

In Microsoft's defense, they do not manage the spelling or grammar
references: they are outsourced.

Bullshit. It's a Microsoft product. They are responsible for it.
Period.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

It is quite possible for the grammar checker to be fallible, and in fact it
has been amply demonstrated that it is. What is much more of a challenge is
being infallible. I think even the pope manages this only by definition.

 

[Beth Melton]

No one here is a "Microsoft apologist". MVPs are actually some of
Microsoft's biggest critics. I give them an earful every chance I get!
<grin>

Sure, it could be a bug but to be perfectly honest I don't care if the
grammar checker makes an incorrect suggestion if it means taking time away
from the developers tackling issues that prevent me from getting my work
done, working on a feature that will increase my productivity, or more
importantly, tackling issues that cause Word to crash. With that in mind, if
I came across this during the beta I wouldn't take the time to report it or
give them an 'earful' about it.

By no means am I trying to downplay your concerns, I realize everyone has
their own priorities, but the grammar checker isn't one of mine.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton

 

[Three Lefts]

No one here is a "Microsoft apologist". MVPs are actually some of
Microsoft's biggest critics. I give them an earful every chance I get!
<grin>

Sure, it could be a bug but to be perfectly honest I don't care if the
grammar checker makes an incorrect suggestion if it means taking time away
from the developers tackling issues that prevent me from getting my work
done, working on a feature that will increase my productivity, or more
importantly, tackling issues that cause Word to crash.

Microsoft has obscene profits. They ought to be able to fix both big
and little problems. I never said this was life or death. actually, I
mainly asked if there is someplace to report these bugs so that when
and if anyone at Microsoft happens to give a shit, they would have
some data to look at.

What I got back was a bunch of pedantic criticism of my writing style
and other irrelevant comments on how the grammar checker really ought
to be fallible.

I was trying to be helpful. I guess no good deed goes unpunished.

With that in mind, if
I came across this during the beta I wouldn't take the time to report it or
give them an 'earful' about it.

Sounds to me like you have long ago decided that the bar for Mircosoft
products is pretty low. No point in reporting anything that doesn;t
cause Word to crash, which it also does fairly frequently.

By no means am I trying to downplay your concerns, I realize everyone has
their own priorities, but the grammar checker isn't one of mine.

It's not one of mine either. I discovered a bug. I thought I see if
anyone gave a damn. Obviously, not.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

We would all like every Microsoft product to be perfect (and I think you
would find that is true of everyone at Microsoft as well). It's not really
an issue of cost so much as of time: a "perfect" product would never reach
market-readiness.

There are ways to report bugs, and all reported bugs are considered. But the
decision to allocate resources to a bug is based on the seriousness of the
bug and the number of users it affects. Bugs that cause Word to crash for
all users are obviously the most important. Any bug that is encountered by
few users and has a workaround will be a much lower priority. We could
report this issue for you, but we know that it would have such a low
priority that it wouldn't be worth anyone's time to report or look at.

In any case, IMO this is not really a bug, anyway: it's a flaw. It would be
a bug if, having determined that your grammar was incorrect, Word would not
let you save or print the document. As it is, it's a minor annoyance.

It's obvious, though, that we're not going to convince you. You detest
Microsoft and all its works and are determined to reject any response you
receive, no matter how well-intended, so I'm obviously wasting my energy.