Keeps inserting redundant paragraph marks

[Matthew W. I. Dunn]

I want to make a quick list of similar info in a document (compatibility mode).
In 2000, I could just copy the text and hit paste over and over. Like:

X
X
X

But, now Word 2007 keeps adding paragraph marks, so the list looks like this:

X

X

X

If I just highlight the TEXT and not the paragraph mark at the end, I get:

XXX

I never had this problem with Word 2000. What the heck's the problem here?

 

[Beth Melton]

Word 2007 isn't inserting extra paragaph marks, it's additional spacing
that's being added after the paragraph (10 pts), which is a new default. You
can remove the spacing using the "No Spacing" style on the Home tab in the
Styles group.

You can also change the default spacing if you'd like, using the Paragraph
dialog box, making your adjustments and then click Default at the bottom,
however Word experts encourage the use of ormatted space between paragraphs
rather than empty paragraph marks for a variety of reasons.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email cannot be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Coauthor of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/books/9801.aspx#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

 

[Matthew W. I. Dunn]

Thank you for the reply.

If I understand you correctly, choosing the "No Spacing" style from Home >
Styles will only affect the open document and no other.

I am somewhat LESS clear about the second part of your answer: Where can I
change to the "No Spacing" option in the Paragraph dialogue box? I go Home >
Paragraph > Line Spacing Options . . . but, I don't see that option given.

Finally, I'm a not only a graduate student, but also a college instructor in
the Humanities. So, I've been using Word 2000 intensively ever since it came
out. I have never had a problem with NOT having additional spacing after the
paragraph. It only became an (incredibly annoying) issue after purchasing
2007.

(Microsoft, please take note! Change this.)

 

[Beth Melton]

To access the Paragraph dialog box, click the Dialog Box Launcher in the
Paragraph group on either the Home or Page Layout tab. The dialog box
launcher is the small arrow in the lower-right corner of the group. Once
there, in the Spacing section, locate the Space After option. You'll see the
Default button at the bottom.

Regarding the default spacing, this was done for a couple reasons. One is
because using empty paragraph marks as an attempt to create "space" between
paragraphs doesn't lend itself to using Word efficiently and it can prevent
you from taking advantage of what Word has to offer. Word isn't a glorified
typewriter and if you attempt to use it like one then it will fight you
every step of the way. Personally, I'm thankful to see the new defaults.
*Finally* I'm seeing Word training manuals that do not instruct pressing
Enter two times between paragraphs. (Now perhaps folks will be trained to
use Word correctly.)

Here are a few examples I give the students so they can decide whether to
use Word as a glorified typewriter or take advantage of the features it has
to offer:

If you are happy with:

- Inserting manual page breaks, deleting them when the document repaginates,
and adding them back again. Or better yet, you painstakingly get the layout
just right and email it to someone. Invariably they email it to back and
tell you "It's all messed up!". You open it and see nothing wrong and think
they are either losing their mind or are just trying to make your job more
difficult.

- Adjusting the font size to force text to "fit to" or span a specific
number of pages

- Adding extra steps when editing such as Cut/Copy/Paste, you know, delete
the extra paragraph mark and insert it elsewhere

- Sorting paragraphs, deleting all the empty paragraph marks at the top only
to re-insert them back between the paragraphs

- Cursing Word because it reformats text on you such as when you:
* Paste a paragraph on a "blank" line and it suddenly reformats
* Type on a "blank" line only to find the format is not what you expect

- Posting to the newsgroups with problems that end up being due to using
empty paragraphs <grin>

Then by all means use Word like a typewriter.

If you use formatted space between paragraphs then you can:

- Use the Pagination features found in Format/Paragraph/Line and Page Breaks
to control where the text falls on a page and practically do away with
manual page breaks. For example it does little good to keep a paragraph with
the next one, when the next paragraph is an empty one.

- Adjust the space between paragraphs to control how much text fits on a
page, or "tweak" a couple paragraphs directly when needed

- Cut/Copy/Sort a paragraph and the space goes with it. Or my favorite, use
<Alt Shift Up/Dn> to move the paragraph

- Have better control over the formatting. Paragraph marks hold formatting -
even empty ones.

- Spend your time in the newsgroups learning and sharing instead of fighting
your documents. ;-)

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email cannot be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Coauthor of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/books/9801.aspx#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

 

[Matthew W. I. Dunn]

Thanks for the reply. I'm sorry to say that I'm still confused.

I went to Home > Styles, and I changed to No Spacing. I'm assuming that
that only works for the document which is open at the time? When I open a
new document, it shows the Normal style selected.

I'm still having problems with your instructions about the Paragraph
Dialogue Box.

I go to the Paragraph Dialogue Box like you say. I see the Spacing section.
But, the Space After is shown as "0 pt." But, that's been the setting the
WHOLE time that I've been having this problem. I had in fact checked this
box before posting here, and the Space Before and Space After were always 0
point . . . and, yet it kept adding the extra spaces.

So, it is still not clear for me how I can make the No Spacing option my
default. Could you, please, explain further?

I'm sorry if my "caveman" approach to Word offends your sensibility. But, .
.. . yes, I expect Word to basically act as a glorified typewriter that will
aid (!) me -- not tell me how -- to produce article, books, papers, whatever
for my academic and professional work.

I guess one can have the attitude: "Shuh, . . . well . . . If you WANNA do
it that way."

Frankly, yes, I want to do it that way. I want a product to do what *I*
want it to do, and not what IT or someone else thinks I should be doing.
That is the basis of CUSTOMER service, viz. the customer (me) is happy with
the product. (I know you do not represent Microsoft.) Obviously, not all of
the people writing frantic or confused posts are a bunch of whiny 3
year-olds. They're customers who paid $100+ for a product that. If a
product is not working the way people EXPECT it to work, there's a problem.
And, I say, dump the attitude and take note.

 

[Beth Melton]

I'm sorry you feel my reply had an "attitude" when no such thing was
intended. I provided some of the rationale behind the change to the defaults
and, as noted, I presented some examples so you can decide for yourself how
you want to use Word. If you want to use it in such a way other than using
recommended methods then that's completely your choice. (As one college
instructor to another, isn't it part of our chemical make-up to provide
alternatives if they are present? ;-) )

As for your spacing issue. I'm not sure what you are encountering. Perhaps
it's the Line Spacing option? That was also changed from Single to 1.15
lines by default.

Something else you might want to try is the following:
- On the Home tab, in the Styles group, click Change Styles
- Point at Style Set and then click "Word 2003"
- Click Change Styles again and then click "Set as Default"

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email cannot be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton

 

[Matthew W. I. Dunn]

Sorry, my last comments should not have been directed at you personally. It
was more me griping out loud and hoping someone from Micrsoft might see it
one day. Once again, sorry that I gave the wrong impression.

I'd have no complaint -- or, maybe, just a little grumble -- if the whole
10-point thing were a matter of security or increased stability for the
program. But, it doesn't seem to be.

Your first suggestion about changing to No Spacing in the Styles section
seems to have worked. (Though, it still shows Normal when I open it in new
docs.) So far, I haven't been experiencing that same problem when I move
around text in my documents.

Here's hoping . . .