Missing Date Header in Outlook Express

[ezandy]

Hi Guys,

Just wanted to settle an argument with a colleague.

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI t
generate and send simple emails via SMTP (To, Subject, Message Body an
attachment) in Outlook with things like invoices, remittances attached
The problem I'm having is that the date header is missing from email
generated this way. This results in a number of emails being rejecte
as spam by certain email servers (Error 552 - no date header....)

My question is then who is responsible for ensuring these emails ar
RFC2822 compliant?(ie include the origination date in the header) Th
MTA, MUA or the 3rd party business application? I suspect the busines
app, but my colleague insists the MUA, as the date can only be know
when the command to send (ie pushing the send button) is made.

Thanks in advance

Andy

 

[K. Orland]

Microsoft Outlook or Outlook Express (which is part of Internet Explorer)?

 

[Slipstick]

Hi Guys

Just wanted to settle an argument with a colleague

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI t
generate and send simple emails via SMTP (To, Subject, Message Body an
attachment) in Outlook with things like invoices, remittances attached
The problem I'm having is that the date header is missing from email
generated this way. This results in a number of emails being rejecte
as spam by certain email servers (Error 552 - no date header....

My question is then who is responsible for ensuring these emails ar
RFC2822 compliant?(ie include the origination date in the header) Th
MTA, MUA or the 3rd party business application? I suspect the busines
app, but my colleague insists the MUA, as the date can only be know
when the command to send (ie pushing the send button) is made

My take: The sending client can add it (and most do) but if the date i
missing, the SMTP should add it - its the responsiblity of the MTA t
make sure its there. The 3rd party biz app could be considered a clien
since it is generating the message... so you are both correct.

f.h. should know for sure - he's a student of the RFCs

--
Slipstic

'Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center' (http://www.slipstick.com

'Outlook Tips' (http://www.outlook-tips.net/
http://forums.slipstick.com

 

[F.H. Muffman]

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI to

My take: The sending client can add it (and most do) but if the date
is missing, the SMTP should add it - its the responsiblity of the MTA
to make sure its there. The 3rd party biz app could be considered a
client since it is generating the message... so you are both correct.


f.h. should know for sure - he's a student of the RFCs.

Good thing this was the only message in my last download or I'd never have
noticed it.

Based on the RFC and the wording below, the client is the responsible party
for entering the data.

3.6.1. The origination date field

The origination date field consists of the field name "Date" followed
by a date-time specification.

orig-date = "Date:" date-time CRLF

The origination date specifies the date and time at which the creator
of the message indicated that the message was complete and ready to
enter the mail delivery system. For instance, this might be the time
that a user pushes the "send" or "submit" button in an application
program. In any case, it is specifically not intended to convey the
time that the message is actually transported, but rather the time at
which the human or other creator of the message has put the message
into its final form, ready for transport. (For example, a portable
computer user who is not connected to a network might queue a message
for delivery. The origination date is intended to contain the date
and time that the user queued the message, not the time when the user
connected to the network to send the message.)

A server should not pay attention to the header. Section 3.3 of 2821:

When RFC 822 format [7, 32] is being used, the mail data include the
memo header items such as Date, Subject, To, Cc, From. Server SMTP
systems SHOULD NOT reject messages based on perceived defects in the
RFC 822 or MIME [12] message header or message body. In particular,
they MUST NOT reject messages in which the numbers of Resent-fields
do not match or Resent-to appears without Resent-from and/or Resent-
date.

But, of course, should != must. As for whether the server may add a date:
Yes. Section 6.3 of 2821:


The following changes to a message being processed MAY be applied
when necessary by an originating SMTP server, or one used as the
target of SMTP as an initial posting protocol:

- Addition of a message-id field when none appears

- Addition of a date, time or time zone when none appears

So, technically, it is the User Agent that should be adding the date. The
SMTP server may, or may not, add the date. It isn't required to by the rules.

And, in this case, that'd be your business app, because if you're just using
extended mapi to create an SMTP message, Outlook isn't the user agent, your
application is. Whatever is submitting to the SMTP stream is the UA. If Outlook
was actually sending the message, it'd add the Date field just fine. (but
my OL programming skills aren't strong, so I bet slipstick would be better
on that front).

 

[Diane Poremsky [MVP]]

Section 6.3 of 2821:

The following changes to a message being processed MAY be applied
when necessary by an originating SMTP server, or one used as the
target of SMTP as an initial posting protocol:

- Addition of a message-id field when none appears

- Addition of a date, time or time zone when none appears
This is what I remembered... so I was half right. <g>

I don't code much anymore either... outlookcode.com is the place to go for
that.

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]



Outlook Tips by email:
mailto:[email protected]

EMO - a weekly newsletter about Outlook and Exchange:
mailto:[email protected]

Let's Really Fix Outlook 2010
http://forums.slipstick.com/forumdisplay.php?f=34

My take: The sending client can add it (and most do) but if the date
is missing, the SMTP should add it - its the responsiblity of the MTA
to make sure its there. The 3rd party biz app could be considered a
client since it is generating the message... so you are both correct.


f.h. should know for sure - he's a student of the RFCs.

Good thing this was the only message in my last download or I'd never have
noticed it.

Based on the RFC and the wording below, the client is the responsible
party for entering the data.

3.6.1. The origination date field

The origination date field consists of the field name "Date" followed
by a date-time specification.

orig-date = "Date:" date-time CRLF

The origination date specifies the date and time at which the creator
of the message indicated that the message was complete and ready to
enter the mail delivery system. For instance, this might be the time
that a user pushes the "send" or "submit" button in an application
program. In any case, it is specifically not intended to convey the
time that the message is actually transported, but rather the time at
which the human or other creator of the message has put the message
into its final form, ready for transport. (For example, a portable
computer user who is not connected to a network might queue a message
for delivery. The origination date is intended to contain the date
and time that the user queued the message, not the time when the user
connected to the network to send the message.)

A server should not pay attention to the header. Section 3.3 of 2821:

When RFC 822 format [7, 32] is being used, the mail data include the
memo header items such as Date, Subject, To, Cc, From. Server SMTP
systems SHOULD NOT reject messages based on perceived defects in the
RFC 822 or MIME [12] message header or message body. In particular,
they MUST NOT reject messages in which the numbers of Resent-fields
do not match or Resent-to appears without Resent-from and/or Resent-
date.

But, of course, should != must. As for whether the server may add a date:
Yes. Section 6.3 of 2821:


The following changes to a message being processed MAY be applied
when necessary by an originating SMTP server, or one used as the
target of SMTP as an initial posting protocol:

- Addition of a message-id field when none appears

- Addition of a date, time or time zone when none appears

So, technically, it is the User Agent that should be adding the date. The
SMTP server may, or may not, add the date. It isn't required to by the
rules.

And, in this case, that'd be your business app, because if you're just
using extended mapi to create an SMTP message, Outlook isn't the user
agent, your application is. Whatever is submitting to the SMTP stream is
the UA. If Outlook was actually sending the message, it'd add the Date
field just fine. (but my OL programming skills aren't strong, so I bet
slipstick would be better on that front).

 

[ezandy]

So far, Outlook Express and Windows Mail

Hope this helps.

TIA

Andy

;314283']Microsoft Outlook or Outlook Express (which is part of Interne
Explorer)?



"ezandy" (e-mail address removed) wrote in message

Hi Guys,

Just wanted to settle an argument with a colleague.

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI to
generate and send simple emails via SMTP (To, Subject, Message Bod
and
attachment) in Outlook with things like invoices, remittance
attached.
The problem I'm having is that the date header is missing from emails
generated this way. This results in a number of emails being rejected
as spam by certain email servers (Error 552 - no date header....)

My question is then who is responsible for ensuring these emails are
RFC2822 compliant?(ie include the origination date in the header) The
MTA, MUA or the 3rd party business application? I suspect th
business
app, but my colleague insists the MUA, as the date can only be known
when the command to send (ie pushing the send button) is made.

Thanks in advance

Andy.

 

[Brian Tillman [MVP - Outlook]]

So far, Outlook Express and Windows Mail

Then you're asking in the wrong newsgroup. As in
microsoft.public.outlookexpress.general

 

[Diane Poremsky [MVP]]

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI to
Are you sending it through Outlook using ExMapi or through Outlook Express?


--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]



Outlook Tips by email:
mailto:[email protected]

EMO - a weekly newsletter about Outlook and Exchange:
mailto:[email protected]

Let's Really Fix Outlook 2010
http://forums.slipstick.com/forumdisplay.php?f=34

So far, Outlook Express and Windows Mail

Hope this helps.

TIA

Andy

;314283']Microsoft Outlook or Outlook Express (which is part of Internet
Explorer)?



"ezandy" (e-mail address removed) wrote in message

Hi Guys,

Just wanted to settle an argument with a colleague.

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI to
generate and send simple emails via SMTP (To, Subject, Message Body
and
attachment) in Outlook with things like invoices, remittances
attached.
The problem I'm having is that the date header is missing from emails
generated this way. This results in a number of emails being rejected
as spam by certain email servers (Error 552 - no date header....)

My question is then who is responsible for ensuring these emails are
RFC2822 compliant?(ie include the origination date in the header) The
MTA, MUA or the 3rd party business application? I suspect the
business
app, but my colleague insists the MUA, as the date can only be known
when the command to send (ie pushing the send button) is made.

Thanks in advance

Andy.

 

[ezandy]

Thanks for everyone's responses.

Apologies, I may have confused the issue somewhat.

I'm generating emails from the business app using extended mapi, whic
dumps email message + attachments in the outbox of outlook (not expres
or mail) and then sends.

The real issue for me is where the responsibility lies is adding thi
header to the message. No doubt RFC 2822 is basic compliance an
observed by all applications capable of generating email messages.

My initial thoughts were either the business app or Outlook. SMT
servers can be configured to various degrees to reject emails without
date header. Additionally so can spam filters.

If it is the responsibility of the business app to add the date heade
through ExMapi, then surely this must be a short-coming and one tha
must be addressed by the vendor?!?!

Alternatively, if ExMapi cannot do this, then I would think that th
MUA is responsible. How else could email messages from Outlook compl
in the first place.

As is plainly evident, I'm a troglodyte on this matter, but at least i
will give me a starting point, as this issue is impacting my business!

Thanks,

Andy

;314426'] I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extende
MAPI to---
generate and send simple emails via SMTP (To, Subject, Message Body
and attachment) in Outlook with things like invoices, remittances
attached.---

Are you sending it through Outlook using ExMapi or through Outloo
Express?


--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]



Outlook Tips by email:
mailto:[email protected]

EMO - a weekly newsletter about Outlook and Exchange:
mailto:[email protected]

Let's Really Fix Outlook 2010
http://forums.slipstick.com/forumdisplay.php?f=34

"ezandy" (e-mail address removed) wrote in message

So far, Outlook Express and Windows Mail

Hope this helps.

TIA

Andy



'K. Orland[_2_ Wrote:-
;314283']Microsoft Outlook or Outlook Express (which is part o
Internet
Explorer)?



"ezandy" (e-mail address removed) wrote in message

Hi Guys,

Just wanted to settle an argument with a colleague.

I'm using a 3rd party business application that uses extended MAPI to
generate and send simple emails via SMTP (To, Subject, Message Body
and
attachment) in Outlook with things like invoices, remittances
attached.
The problem I'm having is that the date header is missing from emails
generated this way. This results in a number of emails being rejected
as spam by certain email servers (Error 552 - no date header....)

My question is then who is responsible for ensuring these emails are
RFC2822 compliant?(ie include the origination date in the header) The
MTA, MUA or the 3rd party business application? I suspect the
business
app, but my colleague insists the MUA, as the date can only be known
when the command to send (ie pushing the send button) is made.

Thanks in advance

Andy.

 

[ezandy]

Ok so it sounds to me like the client (in this case the business app
should be adding the date in the header, BUT SMTP servers must no
reject emails based on no date in the header.

I think I'm getting closer (or possibly not!!)

Cheers

Andy

 

[Diane Poremsky [MVP]]

Right - the biz app should do it, but if not then the smtp server that
accepts it should do it. I personally think outlook should since it is
handing it off, but apparently its getting dropped into the outbox in such a
way that outlook can't add it.

What app is it?

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]



Outlook Tips by email:
mailto:[email protected]

EMO - a weekly newsletter about Outlook and Exchange:
mailto:[email protected]

Let's Really Fix Outlook 2010
http://forums.slipstick.com/forumdisplay.php?f=34

 

[F.H. Muffman]

Ok so it sounds to me like the client (in this case the business app)

Right - the biz app should do it, but if not then the smtp server that
accepts it should do it. I personally think outlook should since it is
handing it off, but apparently its getting dropped into the outbox in
such a way that outlook can't add it.

The server shouldn't 'should' do it, the server should 'may' add it.

Horrible grammar, but I think it's vaguely clear.

Basically, the server doesn't have to add it, there's absolutely no rule
saying it should, just that it can. I'd argue that it shouldn't do it, but
since the rules don't go either way, we're both right.

And I agree about how its getting into the outbox. In fact, lets reverse
engineer it.

The Date field is actually set by when the client submits a message into
the queue, not the server queue but the local queue. NNTP messages are the
same way, you reply offline at 10pm, but don't sync until the next day at
7a, all the posts come in with 10p timestamps (or should, last I checked).

So, the 2822 header must get built somewhere in the clicking of the 'send'
button (or alt/ctrl-enter). Whatever internal code is being called gets skipped
by the business app which just drops into the outbox.

So, your app is letting Outlook do the mailing, making your app not the user
agent, but leaving Outlook to be the user agent. Which means Outlook is responsible
for adding the date.

However, whatever method you're using to get the message into the Outbox
seems to circumvent the code that creates the SMTP header. I don't see an
easy way to get to the Internet Headers via the gui for a message in the
Outbox to verify this, so you might want to pop into one of the coding forums
to see if there's a way to get this to work better.

Or, conversely, just configure your app to not use Outlook and just speak
SMTP and actually be the user agent.