MS Visio support

[uzzer]

Hi, I've set an MS Visio support group at GetSatisfaction:
http://getsatisfaction.com/microsoft/products/microsoft_ms_visio. It's far
better than the forum here, has RSS, tags, interactive profiles and all. So
be welcome there

----------------
This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the
suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I
Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this
link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then
click "I Agree" in the message pane.

http://www.microsoft.com/office/com...713ccc73577&dg=microsoft.public.visio.general

 

[sbmack7]

Hi, I've set an MS Visio support group at GetSatisfaction:http://getsatisfaction.com/microsoft/products/microsoft_ms_visio. It's far
better than the forum here, has RSS, tags, interactive profiles and all. So
be welcome there

----------------
This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the
suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I
Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this
link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then
click "I Agree" in the message pane.

http://www.microsoft.com/office/community/en-us/default.mspx?mid=b0a3....

Sorry. It's too busy. My biggest issue with blogs is the insistence
on using pictures/icons of the contributors. Takes up way too much
space. I don't care what the guy looks like. These are tech
discussions and I'm sure the reader prefers the threads to be as
compact as possible.

SteveM

 

[Paul Herber]

Sorry. It's too busy. My biggest issue with blogs is the insistence
on using pictures/icons of the contributors. Takes up way too much
space. I don't care what the guy looks like. These are tech
discussions and I'm sure the reader prefers the threads to be as
compact as possible.

I was wondering whether to respond to this, but as you have I'll join
in too.
a. I'm suprised the legal eagles haven't yet requested the usual
trademark acknowledgements on those pages, besides the incorrect
software package names and the use of MS instead of Microsoft.

b. Customer Service and Support for Microsoft Corporation - hmmm,
sounds sort of official - check the "passing off" laws.

 

[uzzer]

SteveM, I am not sure I understood what you are talking about. What is
"busy"? What blogs and what pictures do you have in mind?

 

[uzzer]

"the usual trademark acknowledgements" - wow is this the most interesting
thing you noticed in getsatisfaction?

I suggested a promising support platform, maybe the most advanced you can
find, a platform extremely necessary to replace this long outdated and
awkward newsgroup and you are telling me about the legal bul***.

I know I am rude and this is because I am surprised that a platform which
can only benefit Microsoft users and developers, alike is being waved off in
such a lighthearted manner.

 

[sbmack7]

SteveM, I am not sure I understood what you are talking about. What is
"busy"? What blogs and what pictures do you have in mind?

uzzer,

When I click on any of the topics, for example "ribbon toolbar not in
visio" it takes me to a content page with huge Microsoft Title
section, then the huge blue block containing the one line question,
then a one line response from Jerry (including his picture.) that is
about 2 inches high. It looks like the reader could review 2 answers
before he'd have to scroll down. I imagine with longer answers he may
have to scroll back and forth as reads and trys to understand a more
complicated comment..

Not my cup of tea design-wise. But I guess the vote will sort things
out. I always appreciate anyone who attempts improvement. So thanks
for the effort regardless of which way the vote goes.

SteveM

 

[uzzer]

Ah, I see now. Well, I do not like their, design, too, but:

(1) their pro-s far outweigh the con-s: the above mentioned RSS, tags, etc;
neat separate categories for problems, ideas and discussions; an option to
set a problem as resolved; they are currently working on a solution for
duplicating threads; you can edit and delete your posts, etc and etc. A lot
of bells and whistles but *essential* bells and whistles not seen here. Come
on, it's not serious for a support forum not to have RSS. Not to mention what
pains I go through until I login. Rarely happens from the first time, trying
two different browsers - Opera/ FF.

(2) Maybe I'd be exaggerating things here, but I can see an advantage to
those huge visual sections. More space means a more clear layout (the new
Microsoft "ribbon" toolbar itself takes up too much space but I love it
because things are easier to find in those larger blocks). It makes it easier
to see what is the question in brief, pay attention to keywords, then read
the details.

And mind you, as the whole thing supports RSS you can read any new posts/
replies in compact form.

 

[Bill Sharpe]

Hi, I've set an MS Visio support group at GetSatisfaction:
http://getsatisfaction.com/microsoft/products/microsoft_ms_visio. It's far
better than the forum here, has RSS, tags, interactive profiles and all. So
be welcome there

----------------
This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the
suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I
Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this
link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then
click "I Agree" in the message pane.

http://www.microsoft.com/office/com...713ccc73577&dg=microsoft.public.visio.general

Not bad for a start, but there's not much there yet. But I wouldn't say
it's "far better than the forum here."

I'd get rid of the smiley and frowning cartoon faces, though. They
aren't needed and take up too much real estate.

I don't understand your boilerpoint suggestion for Microsoft, though.

Bill

 

[Spence]

Not bad for a start, but there's not much there yet. But I wouldn't say
it's "far better than the forum here."

I'd get rid of the smiley and frowning cartoon faces, though. They
aren't needed and take up too much real estate.

Basically clutter to content ratio of about 10:1. AFAICS no ability to
mark items as read so you know what's new since last visit.

Some people obviously have too much time on their hands.

 

[Bill Sharpe]

Basically clutter to content ratio of about 10:1. AFAICS no ability to
mark items as read so you know what's new since last visit.

Some people obviously have too much time on their hands.

May I suggest a visit to Edward Tufte's site, http://www.edwardtufte.com
and look up his topic, Interface Hall of Shame.

"Start Simple and broaden out from there ONLY as absolutely required" is
one suggestion found there that I think should apply to uzzer's Visio
forum effort.

Bill

 

[sbmack7]

May I suggest a visit to Edward Tufte's site,http://www.edwardtufte.com
and look up his topic, Interface Hall of Shame.

"Start Simple and broaden out from there ONLY as absolutely required" is
one suggestion found there that I think should apply to uzzer's Visio
forum effort.

Bill

Re: "Start Simple and broaden out from there ONLY as absolutely
required"

Tell that to the guys who designed MS Office and Vista and Groove
and...

 

[uzzer]

"Basically clutter to content ratio of about 10:1. AFAICS no ability to
mark items as read so you know what's new since last visit."

Well, believe it or not, I am in no way affiliated with GetSatisfaction and
the only reason I posted this suggestion is because I sincerely believe it
would be of great benefit to both Visio users and developers.

I listed my arguments in support of my suggestion. I will repeat them; not
out of stubborness but for the reason to show you that there might possibly
be a better support platform than this forum here.

GS supports RSS. You can enjoy clutter-free design in your favourite RSS
reader and you can mark items as read since your last visit. RSS is not
clutter.

In GS a user can mark an issue as "resolved" and a user can even mark it as
"no longer resolved" if the problem appears again.

In GS a user can upload a screenshot to better explain a problem or an idea.
What is more clutter - writing a few paragraphs to explain in which menu, you
clicked what and happened what or upload a couple of screenshots where
everything is immediately visible? If you were to help a user, do you prefer
to read numerous lines of text or see an image where the important stuff is
encircled in red (in MS Paint for instance) and there are just a few words to
describe what's wrong?

When you post a new message the GS automatically searches for posts
contaning the same keywords so as to prevent duplicating posts.

IN GS you can edit your posts. If it just came to your mind to add an
importan detail, add a screenshot or explain things in simpler terms you can
do that.

Last but not least - I can log into my GS account without any problem from
Opera or FireFox while it takes at least three attempts and several error
messages until I log into my account here, I mentioned this in the above
posts of mine.

 

[Spence]

GS supports RSS. You can enjoy clutter-free design in your favourite RSS
reader and you can mark items as read since your last visit. RSS is not
clutter.

Does RSS support threading of messages?

Last but not least - I can log into my GS account without any problem from
Opera or FireFox while it takes at least three attempts and several error
messages until I log into my account here, I mentioned this in the above
posts of mine.

I use a 10-year old offline newsreader for all newsgroups. Maybe 2-3 problems
a year connecting to 5 news servers up to twice a day.

I actually like web interfaces when they are usable. I just don't see GS as
usable yet.

 

[Spence]

Last but not least - I can log into my GS account without any problem from
Opera or FireFox while it takes at least three attempts and several error
messages until I log into my account here, I mentioned this in the above
posts of mine.

Just realised what you said here. What do you mean "Log In"? This is a public
newsgroup and no login is required. You could well be better off using an
application designed for accessing newsgroups, at the very least Outlook
Express will do that for you.

 

[uzzer]

Just realised what you said here. What do you mean "Log In"? This is a
public

newsgroup and no login is required. You could well be better off using an
application designed for accessing newsgroups, at the very least Outlook
Express will do that for you.

I tried to test this by clicking "Reply". Apart from that that I received an
error page for the n-th time again, in the fourth, finally successful attempt
I was propmted for log-in. So obviously I cannot participate in the
discussion without a registration.

RSS supports threading messages (my reader is RSSOwl).

 

[WapperDude]

Guess I'll add my two cents worth. For the most part, I find the present
Forum to be satisfactory. True, there may be

some features that could be added that would enhance it's useaility, e.g.,
topic, keyword search. But what makes this Forum

work so well is the quality of the responders, both normal users, but also
those key individuals that have direct ties with Visio.

Most other forums cannot claim this. In addition, the people here aren't
rude. I like knowing that I will as likely receive a

response from an MVP as I will from seasoned, veteran Visio users. That
wealth of knowledge and experience is priceless.

Nonetheless, you've made your case and provided the access to this marvelous
alternatie. Whether or not it's blossoms and

this forum wilts is up to the individual participatants. But, from my
perspective, all of the bells and whistles are useless if the

answers are wrong, misleading, incomplete, or inadequate.

IMHO,
Wapperdude

 

[Spence]

I tried to test this by clicking "Reply". Apart from that that I received an
error page for the n-th time again, in the fourth, finally successful attempt
I was propmted for log-in. So obviously I cannot participate in the
discussion without a registration.

Try using a newsreader rather than a browser. There are a number around, 40tude
is a freeware newsreader.

 

[uzzer]

Yes, RSS supports threading of messages.

 

[Paul Herber]

I suggested a promising support platform, maybe the most advanced you can
find, a platform extremely necessary to replace this long outdated and
awkward newsgroup and you are telling me about the legal bul***.

Why duplicate effort? If you want a web-based forum then have a look
at Chris Roth's Visio Guy forum
http://www.visguy.com/vgforum/

As has been emphasised elsewhere in this thread, usenet is a very
efficient message distribution mechanism, more so if you use a proper
threading newsreader.