Newbie (/ possible convert) Questions

[Z]

Hi,

I'm a current windows/pc user looking into the new iMac G5.

I've got a few basic questions to help me decide if I should make the
switch:

Are there any compatibility issues between Windows Office (including older
versions) and Microsoft OfficeMac 2004?

The iMac G5 runs Panther OS, does Windows Office Mac 2004 take advantage of
the 64bit processing?

How do users find the upgrade path of software etc for Mac app's? Is it good
or are you hung out to dry at every OS or hardware upgrade/release?

I am using the usual word and excel apps and some video editing now and
then, and music ripping, photo editing, but no gaming, will the 512MB RAM
and the 128GeForce card sufficient with the iMac G5 processor/machine?

How good are the standard apps provided with the base package? much is
mentioned about iLife etc but do people really use it or do you usually buy
some other 3rd party apps (as you have to do for Windows). What additional
app's are usually found on a typical users computer for: eg photo editor (eg
Photoshop), music manager/ripper, office applications (eg word & excel),
video editing (eg premier). are the standard apps sufficient at all?

What AutoCAD equivalent is there for the Mac, is it compatible with AutoCAD
(I.e. PC) files?

How will the iMac compare to the big G5 powerMac in speed etc, what
compromises have been made to fit it into a small chassis?

Can I buy non apple upgrades like RAM, bigger harddrives etc? I am a bit
concerned that I will be at the mercy of proprietary hardware that is more
pricey than the same thing for a PC.

Along the lines of proprietary hardware, does the airport wireless equipment
work with pc based wireless servers etc? are there any issues that will
limit me from working with PC infrastructure?

How does the G5 processor compare to say a Pentium 4 3GHz machine with lets
say 512MB RAM & same(or similar) FSB speed?

Sorry about the plethora of questions, but it's a big step as you can
appreciate....if there is a good FAQ that someone in my position (i.e. a
possible Mac OS convert) would find useful, please let me know.

Cheers

 

[Ramón G Castañeda]

Hi,

I'm a current windows/pc user looking into the new iMac G5.

I've got a few basic questions to help me decide if I should make the
switch:

The iMac G5 runs Panther OS, does Windows Office Mac 2004 take advantage of
the 64bit processing?

There is no operating system on Earth that is 64-bit capable yet. While
the G5 chip is indeed capable of 64-bit computing, neither OS X (Panther) or
any version of Windoze is 64-bit.

Therefore, there are no 64-bit applications either, regardless of platform.

64-bit computing is at least a couple of years away.

 

[Z]

thanks Ramón, I think I was getting ahead of myself after seeing the apple
world video on the web where they talk about the next Mac os named something
like "tiger"

also, in addition to my questions, is security as big of an issue with Mac
os? I see they still use internet explorer etc . windoze has numerous
patches and updates, is that the same with Mac?

I also see there is also outlook express, but are there standard apps that
come with Mac that are good enough to use without having to buy 3rd party
apps? (I don't consider wordpad & notepad in windoze to be good enough word
proc's)

 

[Keith Driver]

Ramon,

Suns SPARC Solaris has been fully 64 bit for over 3 years.

Keith

 

[Ramón G Castañeda]

Ramon,

Suns SPARC Solaris has been fully 64 bit for over 3 years.

Keith

And I assume there are so many applications available for it that the users
are migrating by the hundreds of thousands to it? ;-)

 

[Ramón G Castañeda]

thanks Ramón, I think I was getting ahead of myself after seeing the apple
world video on the web where they talk about the next Mac os named something
like "tiger"

also, in addition to my questions, is security as big of an issue with Mac
os? I see they still use internet explorer etc . windoze has numerous
patches and updates, is that the same with Mac?

I also see there is also outlook express, but are there standard apps that
come with Mac that are good enough to use without having to buy 3rd party
apps? (I don't consider wordpad & notepad in windoze to be good enough word
proc's)

No security issues. Even if you're still using MS IE --which has been
totally abandoned by Microsoft as far as the Mac version goes (it will NEVER
be updated)-- that browser is not integrated to the OS like in Windoze.

If a virus reaches your machine, it'll die like a fish out of the water.
There hasn't been a Mac virus for ages, and the old ones will also die like
fish out of the water in OS X.

Your new Mac would come with its own browser, Safari, and email client,
Mail. You can also buy MS Office 2004 which comes with Entourage 2004.

I use Firefox as my browser and Entourage 2004 as my email program.

If you don't want to buy 3rd party applications, you can get by, I suppose.
But if that's the case, why migrate to the Mac? Makes no sense.

Unless you ALREADY know what applications you're going to be using
(Photoshop, Illustrator, whatever) you're better off saving a bundle and
staying with your Windoze box.

 

[Chr's Phelps]

I bought a Powerbook G4 15" in January and this spring I gave my ThinkPad to
my daughter I can't answer all your questions, but I can give you my
perspective.

I have had a couple of instances where sending a Word document from Mac to
PC had some formatting problems, mainly due to fonts, or a style that was
defined differently in word on my PC vs my Mac. I had two VBA scripts
written in Excel 97 that worked in excel 2000 and XP that didn't work in the
Mac version of Excel. I seem to have more formatting issues with Excel going
back and forth, specifically column widths. All in all, I don't think I have
any more or fewer problems than I did going between different versions of
Office on Windows.

No 64 bit yet, but you'd be able to use it when the apps and OS do arrive.

Haven't been through an OSX upgrade yet so I can't answer that. The upgrade
from 98 to NT Workstation was pure hell and everything broke. NT to 2000
went a little better and 2000 to XP was pretty painful. There's always a
little pain un upgrading.

Up until a week ago, I had only 512MB in my machine and did all usual stuff
you listed without any problems. Video editing was kind of sluggish at times
but I'm not sure if that is as much from memory or from processor speed.
512MB should be sufficient but I wouldn't go any less than that.

iPhoto is good for organizing and printing photos and keeping catalogs and
burning CD's. The editing tools are pretty slim. I found that I miss
photoshop LE that I used on my PC, but compared to the hassles of getting
the images on to the computer from the memory card and finding and printing
with my photo printer's app, it's still far better than the windows version.
iMovie and iDVD are really cool. I'd never done anything with video on the
Windows side so I can't compare. I think AppleWorks still comes with iMacs,
and it is far better than any of the built in apps on the Windows side, but
still doesn't compare to Office. If you buy Office, and you should,
Entourage (the Outlook equivalent) works quite well. I occasionally find
some interface issues that bug me. I use Safari rather than IE for the Mac.
Once in a while I run into sites that won't work, so I keep IE installed
just in case. Yahoo's videos don't work on the Mac no matter what browser
you use.

Apple has been using off the shelf standard parts for years, there is no
difference between hard drives Apple uses and anyone else. I just bought
non-apple memory for my machine and it works great. I use Microsoft two
button optical USB wheel mice on all my machines, PC and Mac. They work
great and are $19 at Target. I can't believe Apple still is one button and
no wheel.

I use the built in Airport card in my PBG4 with a LinkSys wireless router
and have never had any problems. I use my PowerBook both Wired and Wireless
in hotels all over the country without problems. I have no ideal what
wireless equipment they're using, but it always works with my Mac

As far as speed, my machine is significantly slower than what you're looking
at, but it compares well with my 2.4 Ghz HP desktop. It's my impression that
the interface on the mac is more sluggish, but it's also mor consistent. In
Windows, I often will click on an icon or menu and nothing happens for a
couple of seconds because it's busy doing something else. Click again
because nothing happened the first time and then find I'm running MS Money
twice. The mac always responds when you click, it's never too busy to pay
attention to you, and doesn't ever leave windows half drawn.

The only applications I miss are PaperPort Office, and Visio. Things just
take longer in Omnigraffle than they do in Visio. My old LaserJet printer
works great with OSX, my old Epson inkjet doesn't work at all. All in all
I'm really happy with my Mac. The problem with switching is that everything
changes at once; it's not just a newer OS or a couple new apps, it's
everything. I carried two laptops with me for almost three months until I
was sure I could do everything I needed to.

Good luck whatever you decide.

Chr's

 

[Jim Gordon MVP]

Hi Z,

Good questions! Glad you asked. I hope my answers are helpful (in line
below).

-Jim

--
Jim Gordon
Mac MVP
MVP FAQ
<http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=fh;EN-US;mvpfaqs>

Hi,

I'm a current windows/pc user looking into the new iMac G5.

I've got a few basic questions to help me decide if I should make the
switch:

Are there any compatibility issues between Windows Office (including older
versions) and Microsoft OfficeMac 2004?

There are some. There are lots of threads about them in the newsgroups.
Office versions 97 through 2004 all share the same file format. Most of
the time you'll probably have no trouble at all.

Each version of office has its own set of features, however, so you
might find some differences. Primary areas: multimedia (PC uses Windows
Media Player, Mac Office uses QuickTime). Visual Basic Macros that are
poorly written are will not cross platforms, but ones that were properly
thought out will. PC Office supports open source Active-X controls. Mac
Office does not support Active-X. Office 2004 has new features such as
PowerPoint presenter view, soft shadows, compatibility checker,
WordNote, and Project that are not yet supported on the PC side. Word
2003 supports digital signatures, but Word 2004 does not. PC Outlook and
Entourage support both support digital signatures and Exchange server.

The iMac G5 runs Panther OS, does Windows Office Mac 2004 take advantage of
the 64bit processing?

No, not directly.

How do users find the upgrade path of software etc for Mac app's? Is it good
or are you hung out to dry at every OS or hardware upgrade/release?

As far as Office is concerned, at one time Microsoft tried to alternate
between new versions for Mac and Windows. The idea was each would
leapfrog the other and Office would continually grow. That idea got
messed up along the way because of OS introductions. So Office v.X was
mostly a port of Office 2001 from OS 9 to OSX. But Office 2004 was the
largest new set of features of any new release of Office either Mac or
Windows IHMO.

I am using the usual word and excel apps and some video editing now and
then, and music ripping, photo editing, but no gaming, will the 512MB RAM
and the 128GeForce card sufficient with the iMac G5 processor/machine?

A gig of RAM would be better. Like Windows, Mac OS will start using the
hard drive as RAM, which is really slow, once it runs out of real RAM.

How good are the standard apps provided with the base package? much is
mentioned about iLife etc but do people really use it or do you usually buy
some other 3rd party apps (as you have to do for Windows). What additional
app's are usually found on a typical users computer for: eg photo editor (eg
Photoshop), music manager/ripper, office applications (eg word & excel),
video editing (eg premier). are the standard apps sufficient at all?

I like the standard apps. I think they are a cut above the standard
Windows apps. They are not "pro"-level, however. TextEdit is better than
NotePad. iMovie is better than the XP movie tool. But like Windows you
have many alternatives to choose from that run the gamut from barely
better than the standard apps all the way to the highest end Pro apps
(Maya, Final Cut Pro).

What AutoCAD equivalent is there for the Mac, is it compatible with AutoCAD
(I.e. PC) files?

I don't know much about autocad. I saw some companies at MacWorld
selling CAD stuff. This link might help:

How will the iMac compare to the big G5 powerMac in speed etc, what
compromises have been made to fit it into a small chassis?

Single processor vs dual processor. Smaller hard drive. Possibly 25-35%
slower than a dual processor. A lot depends upon what you're using it for.

Can I buy non apple upgrades like RAM, bigger harddrives etc? I am a bit
concerned that I will be at the mercy of proprietary hardware that is more
pricey than the same thing for a PC.

Something new and different like the new iMac might have some funky
things in it. Generally you can buy generic parts like RAM, many PCI
cards & drives.

Along the lines of proprietary hardware, does the airport wireless equipment
work with pc based wireless servers etc? are there any issues that will
limit me from working with PC infrastructure?

This question is backwards. Apple + Lucent created the 802.11 hardware
standard, so of course Apple hardware works with it. All of the PC
wireless stuff I've encountered works OK even though it's Apple/Lucent
technology they are using (while generally oblivious to that fact).

How does the G5 processor compare to say a Pentium 4 3GHz machine with lets
say 512MB RAM & same(or similar) FSB speed?

In raw computing power the G5 probably greatly exceeds the P4. Consider
how cheaply you can build a word-class supercomputer with off the shelf
G5 boxes and you'll appreciate the power that's inside.

Sorry about the plethora of questions, but it's a big step as you can
appreciate....if there is a good FAQ that someone in my position (i.e. a
possible Mac OS convert) would find useful, please let me know.

OK
<http://www.apple.com/switch/>

That site does not list my own #1 reason to suggest switching, which is:
Windows: Tens of thousands of viruses, popups, adwares, & spywares.
Macintosh: No known OSX viruses. I've not enountered any popup, spyware
or adware applications that tried to serruptitiously install themselves
onto any Mac. The only virus I know of that runs in OSX is Office Macro
Virus which is fairly tame, and I haven't seen one of those on a Mac in
years.

This alone, to me, makes the decision to switch to Mac a no-brainer.

 

[Z]

Thanks to all for your comments, from what I hear:

The app's issue is not critical as they are generally available for both
platforms, and interaction between the two is not a issue (except perhaps
AutoCAD).
Mac OS is more stable and does not suffer viruses or internet annoyances
(popups etc, I suppose this is because of no active-x support?)
Native out-of-the-box apps are ok, but any hard-core use will require 3rd
party app's (just like Windoze)

For me, as the Mac hardware is more affordable now, and is just plain sexier
than
anything I can see for the PC platform, then as long as it doesn't stop me
from integrating in a PC dominated world I think I'm sold. I will wait for
the reviews of the iMac G5.....

Thanks again to all for your helpful comments.

 

[Keith Driver]

Ramon,

Good point if you live in an office environment. Its great for
engineering though. However technically your point was

There is no operating system on Earth that is 64-bit capable yet.

Which is not true!

 

[Gene van Troyer]

For me, as the Mac hardware is more affordable now, and is just plain sexier
than anything I can see for the PC platform, then as long as it doesn't stop
me from integrating in a PC dominated world I think I'm sold. I will wait for
the reviews of the iMac G5.....

The new iMac G5 sizzles. It's breath-taking. It's Starship Enterprise on
your desktop. It's even cheaper than it's previous counterparts.

Gene van Troyer

 

[Ramón G Castañeda]

Right, Keith.

Ramon,

Good point if you live in an office environment. Its great for
engineering though. However technically your point was


Which is not true!

 

[Paul Berkowitz]

thanks Ramón, I think I was getting ahead of myself after seeing the apple
world video on the web where they talk about the next Mac os named something
like "tiger"

That is correct. Mac OS 10.4 "Tiger", due to be released "in the first half
of 2005" - good guess sometime in the spring - will be optimized for 64-bit.
Apple is pushing hard to get 3rd-party developers to make 64-bit versions of
their programs for Tiger, to the extent of having a fully working version of
Tiger available to developers way back in early June 2004, offering
workshops to developers, etc. I think it's a pretty good bet that there will
be several calculation-intensive 64-bit programs that should become
available within months of Tiger's release.

--
Paul Berkowitz
MVP MacOffice
Entourage FAQ Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org/faq/index.html>
AppleScripts for Entourage: <http://macscripter.net/scriptbuilders/>

Please "Reply To Newsgroup" to reply to this message. Emails will be
ignored.

PLEASE always state which version of Microsoft Office you are using -
**2004**, X or 2001. It's often impossible to answer your questions
otherwise.

 

[Z]

Sorry about another question, however what did Mac users use prior to
Microsoft Office Mac?
Is this the same as what happened to WordPerfect and Netscape?
Is Microsoft the most widely and accepted office app for Mac?

Thanks

 

[Ramón G Castañeda]

Sorry about another question, however what did Mac users use prior to
Microsoft Office Mac?
Is this the same as what happened to WordPerfect and Netscape?
Is Microsoft the most widely and accepted office app for Mac?

Thanks

;-) You might be surprised to know that Word, the centerpiece of MS
Office, was released for the Mac way before it was available for Ms-DOS or
Windoze users.

As far as WordPervert, I still have to use it at work. It's the only word
processor used and accepted by the federal judiciary.

 

[JE McGimpsey]

Sorry about another question, however what did Mac users use prior to
Microsoft Office Mac?

MacXL and MacWord were both released in 1984, before Windows 1.0.

Powerpoint for Mac was released by Bob Gaskins/Forethought in 1987.
Microsoft subsequently purchased it and released Powerpoint for DOS and
Windows 2.0 in 1988.

 

[Gene van Troyer]

MacXL and MacWord were both released in 1984, before Windows 1.0.

Powerpoint for Mac was released by Bob Gaskins/Forethought in 1987.
Microsoft subsequently purchased it and released Powerpoint for DOS and
Windows 2.0 in 1988.

Mac users also had other widely-used apps on the Mac platform:

MacWrite
MacWrite II
Claris MacWrite
ClarisWorks 1-5
AppleWorks
MicrosoftWorks
NisusWriter
MarinerWrite

There are others, but they are no longer with us. Also, the only one around
for the OSX platform is AppleWorks (formerly ClarisWorks).

Interestingly, ClarisWorks (now AW) preceded MS Office as a productivity
suite, and at one time it was the hands-down winner in the office suite
category for the Mac. Apple let it languish, and it is only a pale shadow of
what it could be, IMHO.

Word (and MS Office) has, in the meantime, become the standard for the Mac.
With the exception of the atrocious Word 6.0, Word has been around forever
on the Mac--I still have my original Word for the old 128K Mac, dating all
the way back to 1984. I don't foresee that Word will disappear from the Mac
scene anytime soon.

As I said in a previous posting, I can still immediately access files
created over 15 years ago using Word 3/4 on a MacPlus. That's amazing
consistency and stability in document formatting, IMHO.

Gene van Troyer

 

[Gene van Troyer]

Unless you ALREADY know what applications you're going to be using
(Photoshop, Illustrator, whatever) you're better off saving a bundle and
staying with your Windoze box.

Or getting a Linux distro...

Gene van Troyer

 

[Z]

Yeah I pretty much know what app's I'll likely use, probably like most
others Adobe (Photoshop, premier etc) & MS office apps.

I needed to confirm that there isn't any compatibility issues (or at least
unresolvable ones) with pc's, by moving to apple, which im pretty
comfortable with now.

what's selling me at the moment is that I cant seem to find anything like
the imac form factor in a PC. they have some which are just laptops with
integrated screens, but none that have real processing power and pc
components (i.e. s-ata 7200rpm drives etc). I was looking at the Shuttle
barebones small form factor pc's but they aren't nearly as sexy (even less
so in the flesh compared to the web site ad's).
My only other concern is the video card which looks like it is unreplaceable
and only has 64mb vram. also I suppose 1GB DDR is recommended.

Also when using adobe premier, is it the cpu or the graphics card that will
be the bottleneck?

a question on pricing, does apple usually discount their items later in the
product cycle? I don't mean when it's just to be discontinued and
superseded, but say 6-9mths past it's release date? is this what happened
with the ipods? or the g4 imac's etc?

thanks

 

[JE McGimpsey]

With the exception of the atrocious Word 6.0, Word has been around forever
on the Mac

???

I've *still* got MacWord 6 working fine on a Quadra. Just have to boot
it, go get a cup of coffee, read the paper, then come back to see if
it's done starting up (minimizing fonts helps a lot).