Numbering counter different in header and body ??? Help!

[David Best]

I'm trying to create a numbering system with Word that uses Style
"Heading 1" in the document header, and "Heading 2 …. 5" in the main
body of the document. What I'm finding is that I get results like
this:

[Header ] 1.
[Body ] 1.1
[Body ] 1.1.1
[Body ] 1.1.2
[Body ] 1.2
[Body ] 1.2.1
[Body ] 1.3
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 2.
[Body ] 1.4
[Body ] 1.4.1
[Body ] 1.4.2
[Body ] 1.5.2
[Body ] 1.5.1
[Body ] 1.6
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 3.
[Body ] 1.7
[Body ] 1.7.1
[Body ] 1.7.2
[Body ] 1.8
[Body ] 1.8.1
[Body ] 1.9
[Body ] <section break>



The behavior is as if the numbering counters for headers is different
from the number counters for body text.

I've been tearing my hair out over this for hours. I'm using Word
2002 SP3, I'm using the first numbering list style in
Bullets/Numbering dialog that has the word "Heading" in them. And I
have reset the numbering lists within that style, turned off Fast
Save, closed/opened again, and just can't seem to get the cascade from
Heading 1 to apply to Heading 2 . . 5 when Heading 1 is used in a
header rather than in the body.

If I use Heading 1 in the body instead of a header, the numbering
works properly.

Help! My hair is mostly pulled out now. Some save me!

Thanks.

David Best

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

I don't see any way this can work. The header is a different layer from the
document, and all text in the header repeats on every page, so Word would
never know when to restart numbering "after Level 1." Why are you trying to
put Heading 1 in the header? Can you use a StyleRef field to pick up Heading
1 instead?

 

[David P. Best]

Suzanne,

Many thanks for your comments. I'm not a programmer, so if it doesn't
appear in the Menus, I'm not likely to know about it (StyleRef field for
instance).

What I am trying to do is have a Running Header appear at the top of each
page as a section identifier with a number associated with that section.
Let's say Section 1 is Intro, Section 2 is Getting Started, Section 3 is
Installation, etc. And within each section I want a numbering system for
the various sub-topics that correspond to the Section number. So, within
"Section 1 - Intro", I want sub-topics that are numbered 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 etc.
and sub-topics below that (1.1.1, 1.1.2, 1.1.3 etc.). In "Section 2 -
Getting Started" I want sub-topics 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 etc and sub-topics below
that. And on and on. And of course, I want the Headers to appear in the
TOC too (which I haven't figured out how to do either). Of course, I could
imbed hard numbered Headers and use hidden text within the body to trigger
the counters, but then the TOC entries would also be hidden. Been there,
done that as they say.

You pose the question "Word would never know when to restart numbering
"after Level 1. And my retort is that Level 1 changes on a section break
where the following section header uses Level 1, so why couldn't it know.
I'm not trying to be pajoritive here - honest. It just seems so logical to
me. How's the average guy on the street supposed to know that Heading 1 in
a Header acts differently than Haeading 1 in the body?

Since Word seems to treat Headers as a separate layer from the Body in terms
of numbering counters and TOC references, I don't see how to do this. If
you, or anyone else can give a non-programmer some suggestions I'd be mighty
grateful. I'm happy to imbed some script code, but I don't know how to
"invent" the code from a suggestion like "use StyleRef." I'm sure that's a
perfectly valid approach, I just don't know how to implement it. Sorry.
I'm about ready to throw out the automatic numbering stuff and hard wire it
into the text - typewriter style. Gack!

Honestly, is this need that unique - to have chapters with numbers and want
everything within that chapter to be in outline numbered format using the
Chapter number as the leading digit? Seems like a straight forward
requirement to me. Maybe this is why life is so hard. <grin>

But again, thanks for your input.

David Best

I don't see any way this can work. The header is a different layer from the
document, and all text in the header repeats on every page, so Word would
never know when to restart numbering "after Level 1." Why are you trying
to
put Heading 1 in the header? Can you use a StyleRef field to pick up
Heading
1 instead?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

I'm trying to create a numbering system with Word that uses Style
"Heading 1" in the document header, and "Heading 2 .. 5" in the main
body of the document. What I'm finding is that I get results like
this:

[Header ] 1.
[Body ] 1.1
[Body ] 1.1.1
[Body ] 1.1.2
[Body ] 1.2
[Body ] 1.2.1
[Body ] 1.3
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 2.
[Body ] 1.4
[Body ] 1.4.1
[Body ] 1.4.2
[Body ] 1.5.2
[Body ] 1.5.1
[Body ] 1.6
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 3.
[Body ] 1.7
[Body ] 1.7.1
[Body ] 1.7.2
[Body ] 1.8
[Body ] 1.8.1
[Body ] 1.9
[Body ] <section break>



The behavior is as if the numbering counters for headers is different
from the number counters for body text.

I've been tearing my hair out over this for hours. I'm using Word
2002 SP3, I'm using the first numbering list style in
Bullets/Numbering dialog that has the word "Heading" in them. And I
have reset the numbering lists within that style, turned off Fast
Save, closed/opened again, and just can't seem to get the cascade from
Heading 1 to apply to Heading 2 . . 5 when Heading 1 is used in a
header rather than in the body.

If I use Heading 1 in the body instead of a header, the numbering
works properly.

Help! My hair is mostly pulled out now. Some save me!

Thanks.

David Best

 

[Jezebel]

Numbering doesn't work in headers and footers (or rather, Word doesn't see
sequential pages or sections as separate items, and hence doesn't know to
increment the number).

Nor can header content appear in the TOC.

Fields are on the Insert menu. You don't need to be a programmer to use
them. In fact, you probably have used them already, albeit unknowingly (page
numbers, TOCs, hyperlinks, cross-references, are all fields). Add some of
these to a document then press Alt-F9 to see what they look like. Having
done that, read help on StyleRef fields.

Insert all your headings within the body of the document. If you want to
repeat the Level 1 heading on subsequent pages of the section, set up the
section to use a different first page header (ie, the first page of each
section has a different - or no - header). In the header for the subsequent
pages of the section, insert a StyleRef field to repeat the text of the
level 1 heading.

This is indeed a very common requirement; the only unusual feature in this
case is the attempt to use the header to contain headings <g>.

Suzanne,

Many thanks for your comments. I'm not a programmer, so if it doesn't
appear in the Menus, I'm not likely to know about it (StyleRef field for
instance).

What I am trying to do is have a Running Header appear at the top of each
page as a section identifier with a number associated with that section.
Let's say Section 1 is Intro, Section 2 is Getting Started, Section 3 is
Installation, etc. And within each section I want a numbering system for
the various sub-topics that correspond to the Section number. So, within
"Section 1 - Intro", I want sub-topics that are numbered 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 etc.
and sub-topics below that (1.1.1, 1.1.2, 1.1.3 etc.). In "Section 2 -
Getting Started" I want sub-topics 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 etc and sub-topics below
that. And on and on. And of course, I want the Headers to appear in the
TOC too (which I haven't figured out how to do either). Of course, I could
imbed hard numbered Headers and use hidden text within the body to trigger
the counters, but then the TOC entries would also be hidden. Been there,
done that as they say.

You pose the question "Word would never know when to restart numbering
"after Level 1. And my retort is that Level 1 changes on a section break
where the following section header uses Level 1, so why couldn't it know.
I'm not trying to be pajoritive here - honest. It just seems so logical to
me. How's the average guy on the street supposed to know that Heading 1 in
a Header acts differently than Haeading 1 in the body?

Since Word seems to treat Headers as a separate layer from the Body in terms
of numbering counters and TOC references, I don't see how to do this. If
you, or anyone else can give a non-programmer some suggestions I'd be mighty
grateful. I'm happy to imbed some script code, but I don't know how to
"invent" the code from a suggestion like "use StyleRef." I'm sure that's a
perfectly valid approach, I just don't know how to implement it. Sorry.
I'm about ready to throw out the automatic numbering stuff and hard wire it
into the text - typewriter style. Gack!

Honestly, is this need that unique - to have chapters with numbers and want
everything within that chapter to be in outline numbered format using the
Chapter number as the leading digit? Seems like a straight forward
requirement to me. Maybe this is why life is so hard. <grin>

But again, thanks for your input.

David Best

I don't see any way this can work. The header is a different layer from the
document, and all text in the header repeats on every page, so Word would
never know when to restart numbering "after Level 1." Why are you trying
to
put Heading 1 in the header? Can you use a StyleRef field to pick up
Heading
1 instead?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

I'm trying to create a numbering system with Word that uses Style
"Heading 1" in the document header, and "Heading 2 .. 5" in the main
body of the document. What I'm finding is that I get results like
this:

[Header ] 1.
[Body ] 1.1
[Body ] 1.1.1
[Body ] 1.1.2
[Body ] 1.2
[Body ] 1.2.1
[Body ] 1.3
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 2.
[Body ] 1.4
[Body ] 1.4.1
[Body ] 1.4.2
[Body ] 1.5.2
[Body ] 1.5.1
[Body ] 1.6
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 3.
[Body ] 1.7
[Body ] 1.7.1
[Body ] 1.7.2
[Body ] 1.8
[Body ] 1.8.1
[Body ] 1.9
[Body ] <section break>



The behavior is as if the numbering counters for headers is different
from the number counters for body text.

I've been tearing my hair out over this for hours. I'm using Word
2002 SP3, I'm using the first numbering list style in
Bullets/Numbering dialog that has the word "Heading" in them. And I
have reset the numbering lists within that style, turned off Fast
Save, closed/opened again, and just can't seem to get the cascade from
Heading 1 to apply to Heading 2 . . 5 when Heading 1 is used in a
header rather than in the body.

If I use Heading 1 in the body instead of a header, the numbering
works properly.

Help! My hair is mostly pulled out now. Some save me!

Thanks.

David Best

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Okay. Start by reading
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/OutlineNumbering.html, which will
show you how to set up your outline-numbered headings. To make Heading 1
show up in the header, you use a StyleRef field, which you can look up in
Word's Help.

Making a TOC is easy, especially if you have used Word's built-in heading
styles (see
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/UseBuiltInHeadingStyles.html).
Look first at Word's Help under "Create a table of contents." Then move on
to http://www.ShaunaKelly.com/word/toc/CreateATOC.html. If you want a
complete tutorial, see
http://office.microsoft.com/trainin...ID=RC011356771033&CTT=6&Origin=RC011356771033

Word is quite capable of doing everything you want, and it is really not as
hard as you are trying to make it.

Suzanne,

Many thanks for your comments. I'm not a programmer, so if it doesn't
appear in the Menus, I'm not likely to know about it (StyleRef field for
instance).

What I am trying to do is have a Running Header appear at the top of each
page as a section identifier with a number associated with that section.
Let's say Section 1 is Intro, Section 2 is Getting Started, Section 3 is
Installation, etc. And within each section I want a numbering system for
the various sub-topics that correspond to the Section number. So, within
"Section 1 - Intro", I want sub-topics that are numbered 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 etc.
and sub-topics below that (1.1.1, 1.1.2, 1.1.3 etc.). In "Section 2 -
Getting Started" I want sub-topics 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 etc and sub-topics below
that. And on and on. And of course, I want the Headers to appear in the
TOC too (which I haven't figured out how to do either). Of course, I could
imbed hard numbered Headers and use hidden text within the body to trigger
the counters, but then the TOC entries would also be hidden. Been there,
done that as they say.

You pose the question "Word would never know when to restart numbering
"after Level 1. And my retort is that Level 1 changes on a section break
where the following section header uses Level 1, so why couldn't it know.
I'm not trying to be pajoritive here - honest. It just seems so logical to
me. How's the average guy on the street supposed to know that Heading 1 in
a Header acts differently than Haeading 1 in the body?

Since Word seems to treat Headers as a separate layer from the Body in terms
of numbering counters and TOC references, I don't see how to do this. If
you, or anyone else can give a non-programmer some suggestions I'd be mighty
grateful. I'm happy to imbed some script code, but I don't know how to
"invent" the code from a suggestion like "use StyleRef." I'm sure that's a
perfectly valid approach, I just don't know how to implement it. Sorry.
I'm about ready to throw out the automatic numbering stuff and hard wire it
into the text - typewriter style. Gack!

Honestly, is this need that unique - to have chapters with numbers and want
everything within that chapter to be in outline numbered format using the
Chapter number as the leading digit? Seems like a straight forward
requirement to me. Maybe this is why life is so hard. <grin>

But again, thanks for your input.

David Best

I don't see any way this can work. The header is a different layer from the
document, and all text in the header repeats on every page, so Word would
never know when to restart numbering "after Level 1." Why are you trying
to
put Heading 1 in the header? Can you use a StyleRef field to pick up
Heading
1 instead?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

I'm trying to create a numbering system with Word that uses Style
"Heading 1" in the document header, and "Heading 2 .. 5" in the main
body of the document. What I'm finding is that I get results like
this:

[Header ] 1.
[Body ] 1.1
[Body ] 1.1.1
[Body ] 1.1.2
[Body ] 1.2
[Body ] 1.2.1
[Body ] 1.3
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 2.
[Body ] 1.4
[Body ] 1.4.1
[Body ] 1.4.2
[Body ] 1.5.2
[Body ] 1.5.1
[Body ] 1.6
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 3.
[Body ] 1.7
[Body ] 1.7.1
[Body ] 1.7.2
[Body ] 1.8
[Body ] 1.8.1
[Body ] 1.9
[Body ] <section break>



The behavior is as if the numbering counters for headers is different
from the number counters for body text.

I've been tearing my hair out over this for hours. I'm using Word
2002 SP3, I'm using the first numbering list style in
Bullets/Numbering dialog that has the word "Heading" in them. And I
have reset the numbering lists within that style, turned off Fast
Save, closed/opened again, and just can't seem to get the cascade from
Heading 1 to apply to Heading 2 . . 5 when Heading 1 is used in a
header rather than in the body.

If I use Heading 1 in the body instead of a header, the numbering
works properly.

Help! My hair is mostly pulled out now. Some save me!

Thanks.

David Best

 

[David P. Best]

Suzanne and Jezebel,



Many thanks for your suggestion. I had already been through Shauna's
wonderful web materials on the numbering, and had that pretty well in hand.
What I had NOT explored (in over 10 years of heavy use of Word) was the
field codes and StyleRef in particular. Now I have something that works,
and works well. I think it's noteworthy, and probably worth some feedback
to Microsoft, that no where in the Help system or the KB could I find a
statement that automatic numbering and running headers don't mix. When it
didn't work, my first conclusion was that this was a bug.



Getting the solution worked out was pretty archaic. IMHO, this numbering UI
could sure use a dose of re-thinking. A bit about my solution may be
instructive to someone.



I wanted running headers on each page that declared the section name AND
number, and I wanted the same format in the TOC at level 1. I wanted the
following format, where x is a Word-assigned number:



Section x - Blah, Blah, Blah



I decided to start with style "TOC1", and customized that style to include
outline numbering, and further customized level 1 numbering to include the
word "Section" leading the level number. That gets me the TOC format I
need.



Then I customized the style "Heading 1" to include outline numbering, but
using the standard outline numbering format without the word "Section"



In the running header, I had to insert "Section ", one StyleRef field to
extract the number from Heading 1, then " - " followed by a second StyleRef
field to extract the text from Heading 1. To get the number portion, the
StyleRef field needed the option "Insert paragraph # in relative context"
turned on. To get the text portion, the StyleRef field didn't require any
option modifiers. The resulting running header looked like this (with the
field codes turned on):



Section {StyleRef "Heading 1" \r \* MERGEFORMAT} - {StyleRef "Heading 1"}



Now all I have to remember to do is put text at the beginning of each
section that calls out the section name, and style it with Heading 1. It
ends up in the running head for that page and all following pages until
another Heading 1-styled text appears. It also ends up correctly in the
TOC.



Again, thanks for your suggestions. Without them I would have been filing a
bug report to MSFT. If Shauna's is lurking, an addition to your web page on
numbering that says “don’t try to mix numbering in running headers” might be
helpful to future about-to-be-experts in StyleRef. <grin>



David Best

Okay. Start by reading
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/OutlineNumbering.html, which
will
show you how to set up your outline-numbered headings. To make Heading 1
show up in the header, you use a StyleRef field, which you can look up in
Word's Help.

Making a TOC is easy, especially if you have used Word's built-in heading
styles (see
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/UseBuiltInHeadingStyles.html).
Look first at Word's Help under "Create a table of contents." Then move on
to http://www.ShaunaKelly.com/word/toc/CreateATOC.html. If you want a
complete tutorial, see
http://office.microsoft.com/trainin...ID=RC011356771033&CTT=6&Origin=RC011356771033

Word is quite capable of doing everything you want, and it is really not
as
hard as you are trying to make it.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

Suzanne,

Many thanks for your comments. I'm not a programmer, so if it doesn't
appear in the Menus, I'm not likely to know about it (StyleRef field for
instance).

What I am trying to do is have a Running Header appear at the top of each
page as a section identifier with a number associated with that section.
Let's say Section 1 is Intro, Section 2 is Getting Started, Section 3 is
Installation, etc. And within each section I want a numbering system for
the various sub-topics that correspond to the Section number. So, within
"Section 1 - Intro", I want sub-topics that are numbered 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 etc.
and sub-topics below that (1.1.1, 1.1.2, 1.1.3 etc.). In "Section 2 -
Getting Started" I want sub-topics 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 etc and sub-topics below
that. And on and on. And of course, I want the Headers to appear in the
TOC too (which I haven't figured out how to do either). Of course, I could
imbed hard numbered Headers and use hidden text within the body to
trigger
the counters, but then the TOC entries would also be hidden. Been there,
done that as they say.

You pose the question "Word would never know when to restart numbering
"after Level 1. And my retort is that Level 1 changes on a section break
where the following section header uses Level 1, so why couldn't it know.
I'm not trying to be pajoritive here - honest. It just seems so logical to
me. How's the average guy on the street supposed to know that Heading 1 in
a Header acts differently than Haeading 1 in the body?

Since Word seems to treat Headers as a separate layer from the Body in terms
of numbering counters and TOC references, I don't see how to do this. If
you, or anyone else can give a non-programmer some suggestions I'd be mighty
grateful. I'm happy to imbed some script code, but I don't know how to
"invent" the code from a suggestion like "use StyleRef." I'm sure that's a
perfectly valid approach, I just don't know how to implement it. Sorry.
I'm about ready to throw out the automatic numbering stuff and hard wire it
into the text - typewriter style. Gack!

Honestly, is this need that unique - to have chapters with numbers and want
everything within that chapter to be in outline numbered format using the
Chapter number as the leading digit? Seems like a straight forward
requirement to me. Maybe this is why life is so hard. <grin>

But again, thanks for your input.

David Best

I don't see any way this can work. The header is a different layer from the
document, and all text in the header repeats on every page, so Word would
never know when to restart numbering "after Level 1." Why are you
trying
to
put Heading 1 in the header? Can you use a StyleRef field to pick up
Heading
1 instead?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

I'm trying to create a numbering system with Word that uses Style
"Heading 1" in the document header, and "Heading 2 .. 5" in the main
body of the document. What I'm finding is that I get results like
this:

[Header ] 1.
[Body ] 1.1
[Body ] 1.1.1
[Body ] 1.1.2
[Body ] 1.2
[Body ] 1.2.1
[Body ] 1.3
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 2.
[Body ] 1.4
[Body ] 1.4.1
[Body ] 1.4.2
[Body ] 1.5.2
[Body ] 1.5.1
[Body ] 1.6
[Body ] <section break>

[Header ] 3.
[Body ] 1.7
[Body ] 1.7.1
[Body ] 1.7.2
[Body ] 1.8
[Body ] 1.8.1
[Body ] 1.9
[Body ] <section break>



The behavior is as if the numbering counters for headers is different
from the number counters for body text.

I've been tearing my hair out over this for hours. I'm using Word
2002 SP3, I'm using the first numbering list style in
Bullets/Numbering dialog that has the word "Heading" in them. And I
have reset the numbering lists within that style, turned off Fast
Save, closed/opened again, and just can't seem to get the cascade from
Heading 1 to apply to Heading 2 . . 5 when Heading 1 is used in a
header rather than in the body.

If I use Heading 1 in the body instead of a header, the numbering
works properly.

Help! My hair is mostly pulled out now. Some save me!

Thanks.

David Best