Outline List styles based off of other outline list styles

[Tony]

I was wondering if it is possible to use an outline list style as a
base for other outline list styles?

For example I've currently defined 5 styles, "List Number 1" through
"List Number 5" as outline list styles using the method Dave Rado
suggested in the following newsgroup post:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=ejcbdKmNBHA.960@tkmsftngp03&rnum=10

Then I created two more sets of styles named "XXX List Number 1"
through "XXX List Number 5" and "YYY List Number 1" through "YYY List
Number 5". Each of these styles are based off of "List Number 1".
For clarity:

XXX List Number 1 is based on List Number 1
XXX List Number 2 is based on List Number 2...

YYY List Number 1 is based on List Number 1
YYY List Number 2 is based on List Number 2...

I'm basically using the styles "List Number 1" through "List Number 5"
as a baseline to the other lists. I'm then customizing the fonts in
the XXX and YYY lists to my liking. The idea was that when I update
the baseline style the XXX and YYY outline lists update as well.

You may wonder why we are doing this at this point? The idea was that
the XXX styles would be data for a customer and the YYY styles would
be internal. The technical document contains both internal and
customer data. A macro would be designed to pull out the internal
data thus leaving behind a document with only customer pertinent
information in it. Also the XXX and YYY styles should be the same
except for a little font modification and this seemed the easiest way
to manage it.

Bottom line, is this good practice?

TIA,
Tony

 

[Margaret Aldis]

Hi Tony

The main thing I can think of which could cause trouble is if you use
promote/demote list. What will happen when you change level on an XXX or YYY
style is that Word will apply the next level in the list template, which is
linked to the base style. This will therefore apply the base style.

If you are working on the documents yourself and don't mind this limitation,
the other advantages are probably worth having - you must just always apply
styles directly. I don't think there is any other reason for the numbering
to be more flaky than usual, though it may not ever be thus.

If the documents are being used by other people, who may even have 'tab and
backspace set indents' on, it is probably too risky.

If all you are changing is the font and the 'tagging' of the text, could you
perhaps use character styles on top of the numbered styles?

 

[Tony]

Hi Margaret,

We do not use promoting/demoting in our lists. We apply the styles
directly for each level.

I'm trying to standardize on a group of styles for our technical
documentation group, so I won't be the only one using these styles.
We are using Word 97 and Word 2000. I'm using this baseline
methodology for list bullets and simple lists as well. My major
concern is while I've been working to standardize all these list and
heading styles they will randomly loose their links and then I have to
go back and fix them again. It seems like I'm working with a house of
cards. For example I'll have fixed the list bullets and saved the
document and when I reopen the document the indentations for the
Heading styles 1 - 9 have mysteriously changed but XXX and YYY
Headings are fine. When the baseline numbering gets all screwy so do
the XXX and YYY styles. It seems like every time I get things looking
the way I want them something mysteriously breaks. I've read Word
numbering is buggy, but is it this buggy?!

If the baseline methodology I'm using for these styles is accepted by
Word, then is it a must to create a macro to define all of our styles
and then distribute that to our group or do we just all learn how to
fix styles when they break?

Lastly, how does having the 'tab and backspace set indents' on affect
the document or style when a user applies a list style or any style at
that? For clarity this checkbox setting is in the Tools | Options |
Edit window?

Thanks again!
Tony

 

[Margaret Aldis]

Hi Tony

Word numbering is buggy, but not so buggy you can't use it if you follow the
path and clutch your garlic ;-)

First thing, make sure all your numbering is set up following Shauna Kelly's
instruction at
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/OutlineNumbering.html.

Alternatively, you can set everything up using VBA - on Word 97 at least I
found this was the safest way of getting numbering schemes to keep their
style linking. There's some example code at
http://www.syntagma.demon.co.uk/FAQs/ListRestartFromStyle.htm (this is about
numbered lists, but the pattern is the same for headings). Another advantage
of code for Word 97 is that you can set the tabs and indents separately,
which will avoid Word redefining your tabs for you.

Your changes in indentations are probably caused by applying indents (in the
base styles) from paragraph formatting. You must set the indents in the
numbering scheme - these will otherwise periodically override anything else
you set via Paragraph. (You might get away with different indents in the
derived styles, if you must).

Once you have the styles in a template, you should be fine for all new
documents created from the template. Updating styles from template or moving
via the Organizer is less predictable - but FWIW I have never had problems
updating from template when the lists in the template were set up using the
VBA code method - and of course it is also possible to run the macro to
recreate.

Lastly, the 'tabs and indents' setting will make the tab key promote a list
item - so you need to make sure it is disabled if you want to use your XXX
and YYY styles.

Hope this helps

 

[Charles Kenyon]

--
See: How to create numbered headings or outline numbering in your Word
document
<URL: http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numbering/OutlineNumbering.html>. This
is based on ...

Word's Numbering Explained
<URL: http://www.mvps.org/word/FAQs/Numbering/WordsNumberingExplained.htm>

How to Create a Template, Part II
<URL: http://www.mvps.org/word/FAQs/Customization/CreateATemplatePart2.htm>

Seven Laws of Outline Numbering
<URL: http://www.microsystems.com/fra_sevenlawsofoutlinenumbering.htm>

The following are some discussions on the Microsoft newsgroups on numbering:
Nightmare on ListNumbering Street <URL:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&th=9e790fa7ed2886b3,18&ic=1>
The Joy of Lists <URL:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&th=811287ebce8fc203,15&ic=1>
Relinking ListTemplates <URL:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&th=2350746054c838e,12&ic=1>
Outline numbering: restart doesn't restart <URL:
http://groups.google.com/[email protected]#p>
Format Doesn't "Hold" <URL:
http://groups.google.com/[email protected]#p>
(above list compiled by Dave Rado, Word MVP)

ListNumbering Street Revisited <URL:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&safe=off&th=57df77857e4993ce>

See the latest numbering discussion I've seen, especially post #4 which
contains Dave Rado's concise instructions for setting up heading numbering.
<URL:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&ic=1&th=bce07d7714769f5c>

--

Charles Kenyon

See the MVP FAQ: <URL: http://www.mvps.org/word/> which is awesome!
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