Page headers/footers

[John]

People,
I have an eMac running OS 10.2.8 with Office 2004 for Mac installed. I
applied all the latest updates for Office.

I am trying to create a header for an Excel worksheet. When I go to
File/Page Setup, header/footer tab, I select "customize header" and then
select the center section. I type in my header and then select all text
to change the font style to a larger font. I do a preview to see how I
like it. Not good enough so I go back to select the center text again
however this time the text does not show up in the center section so I
can't edit it - font characteristics or otherwise. I then thought I'd
try to change the view to show page layout but alas the headers and
footers can only be changed through the headers and footers view which
takes me back to the same page setup window. How in the world do you
select it to change it if it isn't shown? There must be a simple trick
because I can't believe this is a bug that hasn't been fixed.

Help.
John

 

[Bernard Rey]

Sorry, I can't reproduce the problem you describe. Be it through the
"Headers & Footers" tab in the Print Settings or by a double-click in the
Header area in "Page layout". No problem to change font size (or any other
setting so far).

The only situation I could find somewhat misleading is when in Page layout
but with nothing at all in the sheet cells. In that case, when you modify
the text settings (which you can do) you can't see the result (but you
couldn't have a preview) as the sheet appear to be blank.

Have you tried the usual voodoo things (repairing permissions, trashing the
preferences files, create a new Mac OS X account, log in and launch Excel to
see if your problem still shows up) ?

 

[CyberTaz]

As Bernard suggests, this is rather unusual & I haven't been able to
recreate it myself.

Have you tried going to Page Setup & opening the list of Headers to see if
the one in question is there? If it is, select it & then try editing it
again. Is it showing up in the preview area of Page Setup>Headers/Footers &
Print Preview?

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[John]

As Bernard suggests, this is rather unusual & I haven't been able to
recreate it myself.

Have you tried going to Page Setup & opening the list of Headers to see if
the one in question is there? If it is, select it & then try editing it
again. Is it showing up in the preview area of Page Setup>Headers/Footers &
Print Preview?

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Bob,
My custom heading is listed in the selection list but when I select it
and go to "customize header", that heading does NOT show up in either
the left, center or right section. There is nothing in any of them so it
can't be edited, although if I click in either the left or right
sections, I at least get an insertion point blinking line. If I
highlight the center section, there is no insertion point "blinker".

Try this to reproduce my problem.
1. Select the center section
2. Insert a first line of text - say 10 "X's" (I'm using Arial font, 12
point to start with)
3. Hit Return to start a second line
4. Type in a line of text so it exceeds the center window width
As soon as the string length of that second line hits the right side of
the center section box, that line disappears. The line will appear in
the actual header but it can no longer be selected for editing.

More weirdness. Sometimes the first line can be edited, (because it
shows up in the editable center section), and other times it can not. It
appears to depend on whether that line is wider the center box. If I
edit the editable line (say to increase the font to 16), hit "OK" and
then come back to edit it again, it will be reset to the original font
size (in my case 12 point). Meanwhile that second line shows up in print
preview but is unselectable and uneditable.

By the way, this anomaly does NOT occur in either the left or right
headers. I can type in the exact text and it will be fully editable.

Something is wrong.

John

 

[John]

Sorry, I can't reproduce the problem you describe. Be it through the
"Headers & Footers" tab in the Print Settings or by a double-click in the
Header area in "Page layout". No problem to change font size (or any other
setting so far).

The only situation I could find somewhat misleading is when in Page layout
but with nothing at all in the sheet cells. In that case, when you modify
the text settings (which you can do) you can't see the result (but you
couldn't have a preview) as the sheet appear to be blank.

Have you tried the usual voodoo things (repairing permissions, trashing the
preferences files, create a new Mac OS X account, log in and launch Excel to
see if your problem still shows up) ?

Bernard,
See my reply to Bob on how to reproduce the problem. I did try your Page
Layout trick and it appears to work but of course once the worksheet
gets populated I'm right back where I was - unable to further edit the
center header.

No I have not tried the "usual voodoo". How do I "repair permissions" (I
don't think I've every done that). I will try trashing the preferences
but I just installed the latest update for Office so the preferences
should be fresh and new. I am the only user of my Mac so there are no
other "accounts" - I am da main man.

John

 

[CyberTaz]

I'm afraid I cannot reproduce the problem no matter what I do including the
steps you listed. See below;

Try this to reproduce my problem.
1. Select the center section
2. Insert a first line of text - say 10 "X's" (I'm using Arial font, 12
point to start with)
3. Hit Return to start a second line
4. Type in a line of text so it exceeds the center window width
As soon as the string length of that second line hits the right side of
the center section box, that line disappears. The line will appear in
the actual header but it can no longer be selected for editing.

Here the second line *wraps* to a third once the center section width is
reached. I can continue to add more lines by continuing to type or by
pressing Return to create a line break.

More weirdness. Sometimes the first line can be edited, (because it
shows up in the editable center section), and other times it can not. It
appears to depend on whether that line is wider the center box. If I
edit the editable line (say to increase the font to 16), hit "OK" and
then come back to edit it again, it will be reset to the original font
size (in my case 12 point). Meanwhile that second line shows up in print
preview but is unselectable and uneditable.

Regardless of content, size or line breaks I have no problem reformatting
when I return to the dialog box.

I would suggest following Bernard's instructions and also make sure that the
top & header margins are set to not conflict with one another.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Bernard Rey]

John :

See my reply to Bob on how to reproduce the problem. I did try your Page
Layout trick and it appears to work but of course once the worksheet
gets populated I'm right back where I was - unable to further edit the
center header.

I'm at a loss...

No I have not tried the "usual voodoo". How do I "repair permissions"
(I don't think I've every done that).

Certainly a good thing to do whenever things don't work the way they should.
Find the "Disk Utility" in the "Applications/Utilities" folder and repair
the permissions. If often helps.

I will try trashing the preferences but I just installed the latest
update for Office so the preferences should be fresh and new.

Nope. Updating doesn't change anything in the user's folder. Neither
preferences nor anything else.

I am the only user of my Mac so there are no other "accounts" - I am
da main man.

Yes. That is the usual situation and this is why it is a good
troubleshooting tip to create a new account and launch Office in that brand
new fresh account, just in order to see if the problem is still there (in
which case you can think it is a system wide issue and track incompatibility
or application files corruption). If the problem's gone, then you can think
it has something to do with user's settings, preferences, etc.

 

[John]

John :


I'm at a loss...


Certainly a good thing to do whenever things don't work the way they should.
Find the "Disk Utility" in the "Applications/Utilities" folder and repair
the permissions. If often helps.



Nope. Updating doesn't change anything in the user's folder. Neither
preferences nor anything else.



Yes. That is the usual situation and this is why it is a good
troubleshooting tip to create a new account and launch Office in that brand
new fresh account, just in order to see if the problem is still there (in
which case you can think it is a system wide issue and track incompatibility
or application files corruption). If the problem's gone, then you can think
it has something to do with user's settings, preferences, etc.

Bernard,
You're at a loss? Hey, wait a minute, MVPs aren't allowed to be at a
loss, right? (see my signature below)

OK, I tried repairing permissions (I had forgotten about the disk
utility). I ran it multiple times (i.e. check, repair, re-check, repair,
re-check). There is one permission that says is fixed but subsequent
re-check still lists it as having a problem
(./usr/share/man/man1/less.1). I remember running into that little
anomaly when I ran the disk utility some time ago. Nonetheless fixing
disk permissions didn't help.

I also trashed the Excel preferences. That also didn't help. I tried
creating a new user account complete with password. That also didn't
help. Based on the latter I have to believe it is an application or
system issue.

One other thing I notice and I don't know if it is significant. When I
type the first line into the center section of the header, the text
starts center justified and stays that way while I enter the first line.
However, after I hit return, the cursor starts in the center but as soon
as I hit the first character it appears at the far left and then fills
the width of the entry box as I type. As soon as the width of that
second line exceeds the box width, that line goes to never-never-land.

This isn't looking good. Any other suggestions? It is interesting that
Excel on Windows (I use VPC) doesn't have this problem. My current
thinking is to either do my spreadsheet in Windows or use Word, which
may be a better choice anyway since I'm just trying to put together a
sign in sheet for a meeting.

John
MS Project MVP

 

[Don C]

Bernard,
You're at a loss? Hey, wait a minute, MVPs aren't allowed to be at a
loss, right? (see my signature below)

OK, I tried repairing permissions (I had forgotten about the disk
utility). I ran it multiple times (i.e. check, repair, re-check, repair,
re-check). There is one permission that says is fixed but subsequent
re-check still lists it as having a problem
(./usr/share/man/man1/less.1). I remember running into that little
anomaly when I ran the disk utility some time ago. Nonetheless fixing
disk permissions didn't help.

I also trashed the Excel preferences. That also didn't help. I tried
creating a new user account complete with password. That also didn't
help. Based on the latter I have to believe it is an application or
system issue.

One other thing I notice and I don't know if it is significant. When I
type the first line into the center section of the header, the text
starts center justified and stays that way while I enter the first line.
However, after I hit return, the cursor starts in the center but as soon
as I hit the first character it appears at the far left and then fills
the width of the entry box as I type. As soon as the width of that
second line exceeds the box width, that line goes to never-never-land.

This isn't looking good. Any other suggestions? It is interesting that
Excel on Windows (I use VPC) doesn't have this problem. My current
thinking is to either do my spreadsheet in Windows or use Word, which
may be a better choice anyway since I'm just trying to put together a
sign in sheet for a meeting.

John
MS Project MVP

 

[JE McGimpsey]

It is interesting that Excel on Windows (I use VPC) doesn't have this
problem.

It's more interesting to me that Excel for Macintosh on other computers
doesn't have this problem. I can't reproduce this at all.

Are you on a PowerMac or a Intel Mac?

One thought is perhaps a font problem, or even a printer driver (though
I don't really know how that would interact).

When you trashed the prefs, were all Office apps closed? Did you trash
just the XL prefs, or did you trash all of them (or just rename the
Microsoft folder in the ~:Libraryreferences folder)? On second
thought, that wouldn't account for the same thing happening in the new
account...

Any haxies installed?

 

[Bernard Rey]

John :

Bernard,
You're at a loss? Hey, wait a minute, MVPs aren't allowed to be at a
loss, right? (see my signature below)

Yes I know ;-)

The fact is that I don't see the same things happening and can't find a way
to reproduce it. I tried with Arial font (which I never use) and it still
worked. Even when the "second line" is wider than the sheet and the center
justified text doesn't totally show on the left and the right of the box, as
soon as I begin editing anything inside, it folds and displays on two lines.
Let's say "I'm sorry, but it works as expected"...

OK, I tried repairing permissions (I had forgotten about the disk
utility). I ran it multiple times (i.e. check, repair, re-check, repair,
re-check). There is one permission that says is fixed but subsequent
re-check still lists it as having a problem
(./usr/share/man/man1/less.1). I remember running into that little
anomaly when I ran the disk utility some time ago. Nonetheless fixing
disk permissions didn't help.

Unless you get a specific error message, just don't worry about what it
finds and repairs, I'd say.

I also trashed the Excel preferences. That also didn't help. I tried
creating a new user account complete with password. That also didn't
help. Based on the latter I have to believe it is an application or
system issue.

I suppose so. It can be a font issue, too.

One other thing I notice and I don't know if it is significant. When I
type the first line into the center section of the header, the text
starts center justified and stays that way while I enter the first line.
However, after I hit return, the cursor starts in the center but as soon
as I hit the first character it appears at the far left and then fills
the width of the entry box as I type. As soon as the width of that
second line exceeds the box width, that line goes to never-never-land.

I just don't see this. It is and remains center justified. Do you see the
size-jump, when the box widens page-wide or does it remain small as it is
when you begin typing?

This isn't looking good. Any other suggestions?

Maybe you can try uninstalling (using the "Remove Office" tool) Office and
then reinstall it from the CD (and run the 11.2.5 and 11.2.6 updates)...

It is interesting that
Excel on Windows (I use VPC) doesn't have this problem.

See JE's reply on that point (and on some others).

My current
thinking is to either do my spreadsheet in Windows or use Word, which
may be a better choice anyway since I'm just trying to put together a
sign in sheet for a meeting.

That could at least be a workaround for the moment, of course.


--
Bernard Rey - Toulouse / France
MVP - office:macintosh http://faq.office.macintosh.free.fr

 

[John]

Today's update (10/1/06):
I think the font issue is more or less ruled out since this occurs with
any font I try.

I un-installed Office and then did a re-install of Office 2004 plus
updates. The interesting part about that process is that when it
searched for previous versions, it said it found Office 98 (which I did
have a couple of years ago but thought I deleted), Office 2001 (which I
have never had on my Mac, Office X (which I also never had on my Mac,
even in test version), and of course Office 2004. I un-installed
everything including common elements used by IE, Outlook and whatever -
I don't use those apps. I also re-discovered why we use Macs. Last
weekend I created a new virtual machine under VPC. I had to re-install
Windows, Office and Project. It took the better part of two days. Today
when I un-installed Office, re-installed it and updated it (including
the download time for update 11.2.5), it took probably all of 30 minutes
total. Sorry, I digress. Anyway, a complete re-install of Office did NOT
solve the problem. The center header still displays the odd behavior :-(

I did discover a workaround however. When I go to Page Layout I thought
I could just click on the header area to select it directly for editing
but that doesn't work. However, if I double click on the header, it does
select it for editing. It still doesn't answer the question as to why I
can't edit center header text when I use Page Setup. Nonetheless this
workaround is acceptable if I can just remember this trick when I need
to do this again.

Since the problem is not related to fonts nor to Office itself, I'm
beginning to wonder if it is related to OS 10.2.8. I'm guessing each of
you is running OS 10.3 or later and that's why you can't replicate it.
If any of you do have access to a Mac with 10.2.8, try it and let me
know what happens.

John

 

[John]

It's more interesting to me that Excel for Macintosh on other computers
doesn't have this problem. I can't reproduce this at all.

Are you on a PowerMac or a Intel Mac?

One thought is perhaps a font problem, or even a printer driver (though
I don't really know how that would interact).

When you trashed the prefs, were all Office apps closed? Did you trash
just the XL prefs, or did you trash all of them (or just rename the
Microsoft folder in the ~:Libraryreferences folder)? On second
thought, that wouldn't account for the same thing happening in the new
account...

Any haxies installed?

Jim,
I have an eMac (i.e. PowerPC). I trashed only the XL perfs but like you
said, that little test should have been overshadowed when I tried the
new account test.

I'm using an HP Deskjet 882C and I updated my print driver to the latest
version a few months back so I don't think that is related to the
problem.

I don't know what "haxies" are, but I run a very simple setup. I'm not
into whiz bang utilities or screen savers or shortcuts - I'm just a
plain vanilla type of user. On the Mac, I use Excel, VPC, MT
NewsWatcher, Mail and Safari on a daily basis. I use Word, Preview,
Graphic Converter and Canvas 3.5 (classic) occasionally, PowerPoint
maybe twice a year. I also recently used Canva X (trial version).
Otherwise that's pretty much it.

Please see my other comments under Bernard's post.

John