pdf saving woes

[Mac_Learner]

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

First of all, can I say that I hate MICROSOFT!!!! Ok, now that we have that out of the way, I can talk about the problem.

I have a word document, with small sized graphics, and when I go to save it as a pdf it now says that my footer and headers are outside the printable margin. I tried fixing the margins and it won't help. When I save as a pdf, it is now splitting it up in 2 different documents. This wouldn't normally be too upsetting, but this is a newsletter that I need to have in one file, with all 5 pages together.

Can anyone help?

I have read up on footers and headers, and have also seen that graphics could be a problem with Word, so I went in and selected all of them to group together so there would be no layering issue.

Even after that, the printer stops printing the graphics and words after 2 pages! AGGGHHH!

Who can help with also?

Just so you know I called HP and they helped me on the phone. We checked if it was my printer, and it's not, so it's just Word!

Can someone please tell me if headers and footers are just something Microsoft hasn't figured out yet?

Should I start all over, I will, I just need to have this done by tonight. Any help or suggestions?

 

[John McGhie]

Yeah, you can say you hate Microsoft. Can we say it too? Can we?
Please??? They're not listening in here, so feel free to say whatever you
like about them

Now: you have two problems (believe it or not, neither of them are "Word").

The first is that one or more of the document margins are outside the area
that HP's printer driver says it can print.

Humour me, here: Set your document margins to at LEAST one centimetre,
left, right, top, and bottom. You can use more, but that's the minimum.

Now, get into Word>Preferences>View and turn on Text Boundaries and
Non-printing Characters (All) so you can see what you are doing. Adjust
your document so that NOTHING hangs over the margins you can now see,

Your second problem is that the Mac printing subsystem starts a new print
job every time it sees a section break with changed margins. You probably
do not need those section breaks, so you could simply delete them (not: this
means you will need to reset the margins and columns afterwards).

If you do need the section breaks, then use a PDF Utility (Google for them)
to join the pieces together later. If you change measurements in a section
break, Apple will start a new print job, and Word can't stop it doing so

Hope this helps

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel

First of all, can I say that I hate MICROSOFT!!!! Ok, now that we have that
out of the way, I can talk about the problem.

I have a word document, with small sized graphics, and when I go to save it as
a pdf it now says that my footer and headers are outside the printable margin.
I tried fixing the margins and it won't help. When I save as a pdf, it is now
splitting it up in 2 different documents. This wouldn't normally be too
upsetting, but this is a newsletter that I need to have in one file, with all
5 pages together.

Can anyone help?

I have read up on footers and headers, and have also seen that graphics could
be a problem with Word, so I went in and selected all of them to group
together so there would be no layering issue.

Even after that, the printer stops printing the graphics and words after 2
pages! AGGGHHH!

Who can help with also?

Just so you know I called HP and they helped me on the phone. We checked if it
was my printer, and it's not, so it's just Word!

Can someone please tell me if headers and footers are just something Microsoft
hasn't figured out yet?

Should I start all over, I will, I just need to have this done by tonight. Any
help or suggestions?

--

Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Nhulunbuy, NT, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[Jeff Wiseman]

Yeah, you can say you hate Microsoft. Can we say it too? Can we?
Please??? They're not listening in here, so feel free to say whatever you
like about them

&!!?@#$%!!!@

PFFFfffft!


Now: you have two problems (believe it or not, neither of them are "Word").

Since the OP is using Word, it's quite clear that he has at least
THREE problems

You probably
do not need those section breaks, so you could simply delete them (note: this
means you will need to reset the margins and columns afterwards).

So tell me why when MS finally got around to changing the
behavior when a paragraph marker between paragraphs is deleted,
to match what intuitively SHOULD happen, they DIDN'T bother to do
the same for Section markers (which had always had the same problem)!

The paragraph marker between two paragraphs holds the formatting
for the previous paragraph, so mechanically, if you delete it,
the new single paragraph would have the formatting based on the
paragraph marker following what used to be the second paragraph.

That's the way it used to work which was, of course, totally
unituitive relative to the application being made. Most people
who attach a subsequent paragraph to the one preceding it fully
expect the formatting of the original to flow into the text that
was just added to the end. After all, if I start typing at the
end of a paragraph, the formatting is the same. If I hit return
and continue typing, any special formatting is usually replicated
into the second paragraph assuming it is defined to be the same
style.

(This is why if you are going to insist on putting format control
in line with your text, it needs to be at the BEGINNING of the
entity being formatted--but then that's another rant...)

Since everyone must have hollered about it, MS changed it so it
now does a little magic. Now when you "delete" the paragraph
marker between the paragraphs, what it REALLY does is move that
marker to the end of the second paragraph and then deletes THE
OTHER marker instead (i.e., the original one for the second
paragraph) thus giving the Application a far more logical and
intuitive behavior...

....except to all those poor folks who had FINNALLY figured out
how to control all those strange behaviors were due to the
physical location of the formatting data in those markers.

So now, from a formatting standpoint, removing a paragraph marker
behaves DIFFERENTLY from removing a section marker, so you have
to manually mimic the behavior of the paragraph marker deletion
when you delete a section marker if you want the same result.

I.e., if you want to delete a section marker so that the section
following it gets the formatting used in the previous one, You
have to copy the section marker that is between the two sections
and then paste it in at the end of the second section, just prior
to any section markers there. You can then safely delete the
marker that was between the sections and the ORIGINAL one that
had followed the second section. Of course, if you are at the end
of your document there, the last paragraph marker with the
section formatting information that you DON'T want will now be
preceded by the section marker with the correct formating. If you
don't like that, you're up the creek and have to then delete the
section marker there and then reset all the formatting for the
final section (which is stored inside the document end marker
where you can't get to it).

And why in the world if the formatting for a section is in the
marker at the END of the section, do they put the TEXT describing
the formatting (e.g., New Page) on the section marker at the
BEGINNING of the section??!! If you see that text and know it is
for the following section and you then try to delete that marker
where the text is located, it will not delete what the text implies.

I can't begin to remember the number of times I've been trying to
clean up section breaks and then trashed the paging and
formatting of my front matter!

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Jeff:

You trying to win "Rant of the Week" here?

You leave the section break behaviour exactly the way it is, thank you!! It
suits professionals just fine.

The paragraph kludge was implemented to try to pacify the Clamouring
Clueless, who are not aware of paragraph marks at all. They have even less
understanding of section breaks: they don't even know they exist.

So I hope they leave those alone: they work fine for the pros

Cheers

Since the OP is using Word, it's quite clear that he has at least
THREE problems




So tell me why when MS finally got around to changing the
behavior when a paragraph marker between paragraphs is deleted,
to match what intuitively SHOULD happen, they DIDN'T bother to do
the same for Section markers (which had always had the same problem)!

The paragraph marker between two paragraphs holds the formatting
for the previous paragraph, so mechanically, if you delete it,
the new single paragraph would have the formatting based on the
paragraph marker following what used to be the second paragraph.

That's the way it used to work which was, of course, totally
unituitive relative to the application being made. Most people
who attach a subsequent paragraph to the one preceding it fully
expect the formatting of the original to flow into the text that
was just added to the end. After all, if I start typing at the
end of a paragraph, the formatting is the same. If I hit return
and continue typing, any special formatting is usually replicated
into the second paragraph assuming it is defined to be the same
style.

(This is why if you are going to insist on putting format control
in line with your text, it needs to be at the BEGINNING of the
entity being formatted--but then that's another rant...)

Since everyone must have hollered about it, MS changed it so it
now does a little magic. Now when you "delete" the paragraph
marker between the paragraphs, what it REALLY does is move that
marker to the end of the second paragraph and then deletes THE
OTHER marker instead (i.e., the original one for the second
paragraph) thus giving the Application a far more logical and
intuitive behavior...

...except to all those poor folks who had FINNALLY figured out

how to control all those strange behaviors were due to the
physical location of the formatting data in those markers.

So now, from a formatting standpoint, removing a paragraph marker
behaves DIFFERENTLY from removing a section marker, so you have
to manually mimic the behavior of the paragraph marker deletion
when you delete a section marker if you want the same result.

I.e., if you want to delete a section marker so that the section
following it gets the formatting used in the previous one, You
have to copy the section marker that is between the two sections
and then paste it in at the end of the second section, just prior
to any section markers there. You can then safely delete the
marker that was between the sections and the ORIGINAL one that
had followed the second section. Of course, if you are at the end
of your document there, the last paragraph marker with the
section formatting information that you DON'T want will now be
preceded by the section marker with the correct formating. If you
don't like that, you're up the creek and have to then delete the
section marker there and then reset all the formatting for the
final section (which is stored inside the document end marker
where you can't get to it).

And why in the world if the formatting for a section is in the
marker at the END of the section, do they put the TEXT describing
the formatting (e.g., New Page) on the section marker at the
BEGINNING of the section??!! If you see that text and know it is
for the following section and you then try to delete that marker
where the text is located, it will not delete what the text implies.

I can't begin to remember the number of times I've been trying to
clean up section breaks and then trashed the paging and
formatting of my front matter!

--

Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Nhulunbuy, NT, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[Phillip Jones]

Except for the fact that in 2004 and below use of PDFMaker which a VBA
thing is used to create PDF's those Page and section breaks would cause
a new Pdf created at the point of everyone of those Page or section breaks.

After 20 years of MS trying to get Adobe to understand the code and they
couldn't figure it out. in 2008 MS has come up with their very own
designed PDF Converter, that you get to by going to Save As.. and
choosing PDF. since MS knows there own codes ( ;-) ) It make one PDF
document and not a series of pdf's you have to put together. As I
understand it Acrobat 9 doesn't even create a PDFMaker. And if you need
to create a PDF in word You either use MS Pdf Converter in 2008 or you
choose the acrobat print driver as your printer. Now I don't own Acro 9
so I don't know if they have the problem worked out or it still does the
same thing on Mac.

Hi Jeff:

You trying to win "Rant of the Week" here?

You leave the section break behaviour exactly the way it is, thank you!! It
suits professionals just fine.

The paragraph kludge was implemented to try to pacify the Clamouring
Clueless, who are not aware of paragraph marks at all. They have even less
understanding of section breaks: they don't even know they exist.

So I hope they leave those alone: they work fine for the pros

Cheers

--
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Martinsville Va 24112 |[email protected], ICQ11269732, AIM pjonescet
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[Jeff Wiseman]

Hi Jeff:

You trying to win "Rant of the Week" here?

Is there a PRIZE? If there is, I'm sure that I can do much better!

You leave the section break behaviour exactly the way it is, thank you!! It
suits professionals just fine.

The folks you are referring to as "professionals" are the ones
that I referred to as "all those poor folks who had FINALLY
figured out how to control all those strange behaviors"


I agree that once a particular behavior is finally understood, it
really isn't nice to change it--especially when they don't change
all of it...

The paragraph kludge was implemented to try to pacify the Clamouring
Clueless, who are not aware of paragraph marks at all.

I resemble that remark! (at least I used to...)

It is definitely a klooge in that it departs from a previously
consistent structure.

They have even less
understanding of section breaks: they don't even know they exist.

Well, even if you know they exist, modifying or deleting them can
still surprise you with the end results if you don't plan
reeeaaally careful.

My fundamental issue is that formatting shouldn't be embedded in
the middle of text as though it were text itself. That is a
throwback to the old text markup language approach to things. And
if you are going to use such an approach, the controls need to
always be at the BEGINNING of a sequential object and not at the
end IMHO. Things seem to be just more intuitive that
way--especially to the uninitiated.

Of course, if a person has already done it differently for years,
then their expectations are more likely going to be based on that
experience.

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Jeff:

Is there a PRIZE? If there is, I'm sure that I can do much better!

There IS a prize, but you have to hit Olympic standard first: some of us
trained in the Vista group. So the bar is very high... The trolls in there
are worse than MacMacs...

My fundamental issue is that formatting shouldn't be embedded in
the middle of text as though it were text itself.

Then you must be very pleased with Word. It hasn't been, since Word 2

There's a pair of pointers there: they indicate the row numbers in the
formatting tables, which are stored at the end of the document, in which the
style for the preceding string resides.

Internally, ALL formatting is a style. That way, you only have to store
each set of formatting once, instead of every time it is used. Makes the
document a LOT more compact.

Cheers

--

Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Nhulunbuy, NT, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[Jeff Wiseman]

Hi Jeff:




There IS a prize, but you have to hit Olympic standard first: some of us
trained in the Vista group. So the bar is very high... The trolls in there
are worse than MacMacs...

OK, I know when I'm out of my league

So first prize must be a free copy of Vista? If so then second
prize must be TWO free copies of Vista!

Then you must be very pleased with Word. It hasn't been, since Word 2

There's a pair of pointers there: they indicate the row numbers in the
formatting tables, which are stored at the end of the document, in which the
style for the preceding string resides.

But the end result is the same, isn't it? If I click and drag
across several text characters and delete them, the formatting
for the others around it remain intact. However, If I happen to
include a paragraph mark or section mark in the selection of text
(i.e., in the MIDDLE or on the end of the text I've selected)
then I'm going to trash some formatting. Whether the formatting
itself, or just pointers to the syle go away, the end result is
the same. Something other than text was altered and now I'm faced
with having to reformat something because I may have deleted one
"text" character too many.

And of course, when the document has not been rigorously built
using styles and limited exceptions, it is a nuisance to try and
replicate what you just removed (unless of course you had Keep
Formatting turned on but it is still a nuisance since the "text"
character that you deleted can't be just typed back in).

Now I could easily be way out in left field here as anytime
combining two objects with differing style is done, somehow the
end result has to be arbitrated. This is an essential function
which has to be defined one way or the other and the marker style
is as good as any. I still would prefer a tool that used a mark
to indicate that a document, section, or paragraph was STARTING
rather than finishing. This may just be from my old days of
software coding and object analysis where you had to define what
you were going to work with BEFORE you starting doing anything
with it

BTW I do have mixed feelings about the kloodge added to the
paragraph markers. Paragraph joining is more intuitive to the
uninitiated (and me , but it is now totally inconsistent with
the in-line section and document marks which makes the section
and document level behavior even harder to understand by newbies.
In my book, consistancy in structure should have a lot of weight
(other than consistancy in the inconsistancy of a product)

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Jeff:

So first prize must be a free copy of Vista? If so then second
prize must be TWO free copies of Vista!

Yes, that's the one!! Windows Vista Ultimate, actually -- guaranteed to be
slow even on a 8-core machine with 16 gigs of memory

But the end result is the same, isn't it? If I click and drag
across several text characters and delete them, the formatting
for the others around it remain intact. However, If I happen to
include a paragraph mark or section mark in the selection of text
(i.e., in the MIDDLE or on the end of the text I've selected)
then I'm going to trash some formatting.

Sadly, one of the immutable laws of the universe runs roughly along the
lines of "If you insist on deleting ALL of the text to which the formatting
applies, then the formatting reference will indeed go away

However, the formatting itself hasn't gone anywhere. Simply re-apply the
style, and you will re-apply the exact same formatting.

There is no way that anyone can make bad work practices either "safe" or
"forgiving". But if you get even close to good work practices, you will
rapidly be able to fix any unforseen side-effects.

Of course, if you really stuff it up, Word has more than 99 levels of "Undo"
to get you back where you want to be. Or you can simply re-open the
document without saving, or open the backup document if you have saved.

There's a hell of a lot of life-belts and lifeboats on this ship

I still would prefer a tool that used a mark
to indicate that a document, section, or paragraph was STARTING
rather than finishing.

Well, that's one of those design decision that was lost in the mists of
time. Back then, they chose to use the property container as the string
terminator because it enabled them to save four bytes per paragraph

BTW I do have mixed feelings about the kloodge added to the
paragraph markers. Paragraph joining is more intuitive to the
uninitiated (and me , but it is now totally inconsistent with
the in-line section and document marks which makes the section
and document level behavior even harder to understand by newbies.
In my book, consistancy in structure should have a lot of weight
(other than consistancy in the inconsistancy of a product)

I am sure the coder who implemented it would agree with you. Unfortunately,
as you well know, the intransigence of Marketing is exceeded only by their
incomprehension.

Cheers
--

Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Nhulunbuy, NT, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[Jeff Wiseman]

Of course, if you really stuff it up, Word has more than 99 levels of "Undo"
to get you back where you want to be. Or you can simply re-open the
document without saving, or open the backup document if you have saved.

There's a hell of a lot of life-belts and lifeboats on this ship

Darn good thing on a ship that sinks soooooo easily!

Problem is that all the crew has jumped ship so its up to the
passengers to find their own life vests

 

[John McGhie]

Yeah, well, you know what they say: "Pay attention to the safety briefing,
because if you ever need it, everyone else will be too busy saving their own
skin to worry about YOU!"

Darn good thing on a ship that sinks soooooo easily!

Problem is that all the crew has jumped ship so its up to the
passengers to find their own life vests

--

Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Nhulunbuy, NT, Australia. mailto:[email protected]