Preferences bug?

[Mark Pavlick]

List members:

I've asked Word 2008 via Preferences functioning on my Intel Mac
running 10.5.6 to save backup copies of documents in a specific
folder. Word repeatedly fails to do this, putting the backups instead
on my Desktop.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts.

- Mark Pavlick

 

[CyberTaz]

How - exactly - did you tell Word to save your backups to a folder? Word
always saves backups in the same location as the file it's backing up.
AFAIK, there is no setting in Preferences or otherwise to change that.

I believe what you may have done is to specify a default location for
AutoRecover Data in Word> Preferences> File Locations, but that has
*nothing* to do with backup files. AutoRecover Data is a temporary file
containing only the recent unsaved changes so that Word can attempt recover
that data for you in the event of a critical failure. Those files are
typically deleted once the file is safely closed & saved.

PS: I'd also suggest that you get out of the habit of saving files on your
desktop. It may seem "convenient" initially but it soon becomes a rat's nest
& OS X doesn't handle the desktop the same way it handles folders.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Mark Pavlick]

How - exactly - did you tell Word to save your backups to a folder? Word
always saves backups in the same location as the file it's backing up.
AFAIK, there is no setting in Preferences or otherwise to change that.

I believe what you may have done is to specify a default location for
AutoRecover Data in Word> Preferences> File Locations, but that has
*nothing* to do with backup files. AutoRecover Data is a temporary file
containing only the recent unsaved changes so that Word can attempt recover
that data for you in the event of a critical failure. Those files are
typically deleted once the file is safely closed & saved.

PS: I'd also suggest that you get out of the habit of saving files on your
desktop. It may seem "convenient" initially but it soon becomes a rat's nest
& OS X doesn't handle the desktop the same way it handles folders.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

In "File Locations" under "Preferences" there is a choice for
choosing the location for Autorecover files. I created a folder named
"Backups" in my Microsoft User Directory folder. For whatever reason
Word won't accept this location, instead leaves these Autorecover
files on my desktop.
Thanks for any information.

 

[CyberTaz]

Before we go off chasing a ghost I'd like to better understand why you want
to have the AutoRecover files created in a location other than the
default... which is also in the MUD. These files are only temporary in the
first place and are not "backups". When the file to which one pertains is
closed in a normal manner the AutoRecover Data for that file is deleted.

As to why AutoRecover Data files are being created on the desktop, I'm not
100% sure. The only time I've seen anything like that happen it has been due
to file system errors. I' first of all run Disk Utility - Verify Disk to see
if it turns up anything & proceed accordingly.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Mark Pavlick]

Before we go off chasing a ghost I'd like to better understand why you want
to have the AutoRecover files created in a location other than the
default... which is also in the MUD. These files are only temporary in the
first place and are not "backups". When the file to which one pertains is
closed in a normal manner the AutoRecover Data for that file is deleted.

As to why AutoRecover Data files are being created on the desktop, I'm not
100% sure. The only time I've seen anything like that happen it has been due
to file system errors. I' first of all run Disk Utility - Verify Disk to see
if it turns up anything & proceed accordingly.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

If you will look under Preferences under "Save" there is an
option that can be checked for "Always create backup copies.". I do
like backup copies, so I checked it.
Another Preference, under "File Locations", is to specify where
Autorecover files should be stored. I chose the MUD folder.
Going back to my original question...if these two file types
aren't the same thing, how do I tell Word where to put the backup
copies? For whatever reason Word is putting them on the desktop. This
isn't something I chose.
I've fixed permissions multiple times.
Thanks for any information.

 

[CyberTaz]

You can't tell it where to put the backups. Backup copies are *always*
stored in the same folder as the original file - Are you saving your files
to the Desktop? If so, that's why the backups are being stored there. There
is no option to change that. If you want to have the backups in a different
location you'll have to move them in Finder.

If you're saving the files to other folders but their backups are being
created on the Desktop it suggests a file management problem at the OS
level. Repair Disk *Permissions* is not what I suggested. There is a second
feature of Disk Utility which is Verify/Repair Disk... *Verify Disk* is what
I wrote. Run that to see if any errors are detected. Check Disk Utility's
Help for further instructions on its use.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Mark Pavlick]

You can't tell it where to put the backups. Backup copies are *always*
stored in the same folder as the original file - Are you saving your files
to the Desktop? If so, that's why the backups are being stored there. There
is no option to change that. If you want to have the backups in a different
location you'll have to move them in Finder.

If you're saving the files to other folders but their backups are being
created on the Desktop it suggests a file management problem at the OS
level. Repair Disk *Permissions* is not what I suggested. There is a second
feature of Disk Utility which is Verify/Repair Disk... *Verify Disk* is what
I wrote. Run that to see if any errors are detected. Check Disk Utility's
Help for further instructions on its use.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

I've verified the disk multiple times.
My documents all go to the MUD folder. The backups still end up
on the desktop.
Maybe this is a problem that will be fixed with the next version
of Microsoft Office.

 

[CyberTaz]

Well, nothing personal, but I doubt that it will be "fixed" in the next
version because it isn't "broken" in this one Yours is the only report
I've seen of any such behavior in the time 2008 has been on the market. Nor
were there any reports of the sort during the Beta testing. I'm fairly
certain that the problem is specific to your local installation - it's just
a matter of determining the cause & getting it resolved.

To that end there are some diagnostic steps to take:

1) Launch Word while holding the Shift key. Does the problem persist?

2) Log into your User Account while holding the Shift key then launch Word
as usual. Does the problem persist?

3) Create a new User Account & run Word from there. Same problem?

What are the names of the files being created on the Desktop?

On a separate issue: I won't engage in a debate over top posting versus
bottom posting - there are valid arguments pro/con each. What I do ask,
however, is that you follow the lead established in any conversation
regardless of what your personal convictions may be. IOW, if the first
response top posts to the message respond in like manner - if the first
response bottom posts, reply in that way. Conversations that repeatedly
bounce from top to bottom are terribly difficult to follow & the longer it
goes on the more the problem is magnified. Thanks for understanding

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Mark Pavlick]

4/2
To whom it may concern:

1) I've gone through the maneuvers you suggested. None of them
made any difference; backup files still appear on the desktop. They
all have "docx" appended to them.
Therefore, I've turned off the "backup" Preference, obviating
the problem.
2) This web page describes itself as all-volunteer. Why,
therefore, do you speak on behalf of Microsoft? "Yours is the only
report
I've seen of any such behavior in the time 2008 has been on the
market. Nor were there any reports of the sort during the beta
testing. I'm fairly
certain that the problem is specific to your local installation - it's
just a matter of determining the cause & getting it resolved."
How would you know? If you're truly only a volunteer, there
must obviously be plenty of information you don't know about newly-
released Microsoft products - not that there would be any shame in
that.
There are other Microsoft product help pages. They do report
problems similar to the one I experienced.
3) A former Microsoft engineer told me that all existing software,
most certainly including Microsoft products, is "filled with bugs."
Why pretend otherwise? Who could believe otherwise with a straight
face?
4) I'm looking into other other word processing programs, including
open source programs. I suspect more work has gone into them than into
equivalent Microsoft products for the Mac.

- Mark

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Mark:

Yes, Bob is a volunteer. So am I, and so is anyone else who tries to help
in here. I checked everything Bob posted on this subject, but I did not see
him "speaking for Microsoft" anywhere? Please do share where you saw that??

However, Bob is an MVP, as am I. This means he has indeed seen every fault
report that has appeared in here in the past five years or so. The product
you're complaining about is only two years old, so if there was a report of
this bug, he would have seen it. So would I...

Bob was on the beta test for the product. So was I. I never saw it there.
I have a very hazy memory that the bug might have been seen in the first
beta version of the product that was made available to some testers. Are
you running a stolen beta copy, by any chance?

We have the ability to search the Microsoft Connect bug database for bugs.
So do you, if you create an account. It's not listed there.

Chances are Bob asked one of the Microsoft engineers who CURRENTLY work for
Microsoft, before posting: it's just an email. It's not the "newly
released" products we struggle with ‹ we often get more information than an
engineer working on them (because of the way the software teams are
structured, we see the whole product, an engineer sees only the bit he or
she is working on).

So, I would be inclined to take Bob's word for it

I just tested here to make sure: the AutoRecover files location has no
effect on the location of the backup files. They are written to the folder
that contains the original, regardless of the setting of that location.

The only thing I can imagine that would cause this problem would be if you
have somehow locked yourself out of your System /Temp folder. That's where
Word puts its temp and autorecover files. I've never seen it but I could
imagine that if it could not write to the system temp, it may put the files
in the User's desktop. I have not managed to provoke this behaviour here.

Yes, all non-trivial software has some bugs in it. "Filled with bugs" is a
bit hyperbolic, but there are known bugs in Word 2008. This is not one of
them Microsoft has several gigabytes of support documentation on its
servers, many of which state that they were written to work around a problem
in one of its products. I think only a person who was unable to read,
listen, or see, could claim that the corporation was "hiding" the fact that
some of their products have bugs

Microsoft Word for the Mac has about six thousand man-years development in
it. If you can find another product that gets within a quarter of that
number, please tell ME which one it is

You have a nice day, now...

4/2
To whom it may concern:

1) I've gone through the maneuvers you suggested. None of them
made any difference; backup files still appear on the desktop. They
all have "docx" appended to them.
Therefore, I've turned off the "backup" Preference, obviating
the problem.
2) This web page describes itself as all-volunteer. Why,
therefore, do you speak on behalf of Microsoft? "Yours is the only
report
I've seen of any such behavior in the time 2008 has been on the
market. Nor were there any reports of the sort during the beta
testing. I'm fairly
certain that the problem is specific to your local installation - it's
just a matter of determining the cause & getting it resolved."
How would you know? If you're truly only a volunteer, there
must obviously be plenty of information you don't know about newly-
released Microsoft products - not that there would be any shame in
that.
There are other Microsoft product help pages. They do report
problems similar to the one I experienced.
3) A former Microsoft engineer told me that all existing software,
most certainly including Microsoft products, is "filled with bugs."
Why pretend otherwise? Who could believe otherwise with a straight
face?
4) I'm looking into other other word processing programs, including
open source programs. I suspect more work has gone into them than into
equivalent Microsoft products for the Mac.

- Mark

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Sydney, Australia. mailto:[email protected]