Prevent Word view-only from munching mod date?

[henryn]

Folks:

Word 2004, MacOS 10.3.5.

Would someone remind me how to prevent Word from changing the file
modification date when a file is opened, simply viewed --possible scrolled--
but not modified in any visible way or printed?

This seems to occur even if I view a Word document for a total of 10
seconds, no more -- just long enough to recognize the contents -- then hit
the close button.

The last I recall, here, someone told me to disable a periodic update by
Entourage of style-borne addresses. I think someone else told me the
preference setting associated with this update didn't have any effect--maybe
in some previous version.

Anyway, I tried whatever it was, but it evidently that didn't do the trick.

How do I prevent Word form changing a file modification date for a file that
I view and don't in any way modify?

Should it be possible for any change to be made to the file system without a
dialog? In this case, when I hit the close button, if Word is going to
change something --anything at all-- I think it should warn me "Do you want
to save changes to this document before closing?" and give me a chance to
say "Don't Save."

Thanks,

Henry

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[matt neuburg]

How do I prevent Word form changing a file modification date for a file that
I view and don't in any way modify?

I've never seen such a thing. If the red dot at the upper left of the
window does not get a black dot in the middle of it, the document is not
dirty, and it has not been modified, and when you close it, the modified
date will not be changed.

Should it be possible for any change to be made to the file system without a
dialog? In this case, when I hit the close button, if Word is going to
change something --anything at all-- I think it should warn me "Do you want
to save changes to this document before closing?" and give me a chance to
say "Don't Save."

You are quite right. If the document is being modified without your
being notified, something is very wrong. This sounds like the behavior
of a macro virus - it would modify your document as it is opened and
then immediately save it, so that you would not know of the change. m.

 

[henryn]

Matt:

Thank for your response on this thread:

I've never seen such a thing.

Lucky you!

If the red dot at the upper left of the window does not get a black dot in the
middle of it, the document is not dirty, and it has not been modified, and
when you close it, the modified date will not be changed.

Agreed.

Would you agree that if anything changed about the document, even page set
up -- but file position with respect to scrolling, you _will see a "Do you
want to save changes to this document before closing?" dialog?

I would think so. I have my arguments with page setup constituting a
document change, but I'll let those go.

Well, I have about 7 documents in my archive folder that I know I didn't
change, yet these show mod dates in the recent month, during the period I've
been referring to the archive, being very careful to make no changes. Even
better... I would have seen the "Do you want to save changes to this
document before closing?" dialog and been able to recover.

Fortunately I periodically mirror this HDD to another, so I have a pretty
solid backup of this folder, and I've restored it.

I made a test copy in another folder of one of the files that had showed up
as being modified today.

Unfortunately, after playing around with this file for about 30 minutes, I
can't get it to exhibit the problem.

OK, I'll be doing some research in the archives during the next week. If I
notice that the mod date of a file changes again, how do I prove I didn't
actually change something AND missed seeing the "Do you want to save changes
to this document before closing?" dialog AND hit a CR to accept the changes?

I think all I can do is assert that this happens It just isn't easy to
prove or instrument. Even before and after screen shots would be pretty
unconvincing.

Ultimately, I guess I should lock these files, but I don't know of a bulk
lock technique -- there are 159 files in this folder. I suppose someone's
got an AppleScript somewhere....or I could mess with Unix permissions -- not
sure how get-info "locked" corresponds to unix-speak, though.

Sometimes it is hard to remember what the original task was.

You are quite right. If the document is being modified without your
being notified, something is very wrong. This sounds like the behavior
of a macro virus - it would modify your document as it is opened and
then immediately save it, so that you would not know of the change. m.

Thanks for the suggestion.

No macros shown in this file, and Preferences-->Security-->Warn before
opening a file that contains macros _is_ enabled.

Any other ideas?

Thanks,

Henry

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[matt neuburg]

Thanks for the suggestion.

No macros shown in this file, and Preferences-->Security-->Warn before
opening a file that contains macros _is_ enabled.

Any other ideas?

The virus would not have to be in this file in order for the problem to
occur. It could be in any template in use at the time, including Normal.

m.

 

[henryn]

Matt:

Thanks for your response on this thread:

The virus would not have to be in this file in order for the problem to
occur. It could be in any template in use at the time, including Normal.

Sorry, I should have said what I saw when I checked Tools-->Macro-->Macros:
Nada. No macros whatsoever, not in the current document, not in Normal, not
in "All Active templates and documents". (Despite the entreaties of people,
including MVPs to get me to define and use macros!) Of course "Word
Commands" has a whole bunch of 'em. I'm guessing (hoping) that a virus
can't be insinuated into that area.

Is that sufficient? I did check (and just rechecked) Word help, which
didn't seem to say anything about how to assure myself that I'm macro
virus-free. The KB has a lot of material, but not anything obviously
relevant.

I run NAV from time to time, and have _never_ detected any kind of
infection. But I'm not sure that any system-wide antivirus program can
detect a macro infection in a template.

Thanks,

Henry


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[Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]]

Hey Henry,

What version of MacOS are you running?

This could be an OS issue, so upgrading to the latest version of Panther
might fix it. (I'm not sure about Jaguar though...)


Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
Please do not send email directly to this e-mail address. It is for
newsgroup purposes only.

Find out everything about Microsoft Mac Newsgroups at:
[http://www.microsoft.com/mac/community/community.aspx?pid=newsgroups]
Check out product updates and news & info at:
[http://www.microsoft.com/mac]

 

[henryn]

Jeffrey Weston:

Thanks for your post on this thread:

Hey Henry,

What version of MacOS are you running?

Sorry, this fell of the end of the thread, was in my original post: Word
2004, MacOS 10.3.5.

This could be an OS issue, so upgrading to the latest version of Panther
might fix it. (I'm not sure about Jaguar though...)

I sure wish I could upgrade and fix this...

Your response might be understood to confirm that a problem like this has
been reported before. Would you care to elaborate?

I've only seen such an issue when poking through long folder lists of mostly
Word files. This reflects both the longevity of the particular project
--which happens to be a pro bono, public service job-- and my practice of
saving Word documents very often. It might show up if I was working with
archives from other applications, but that doesn't happen for me.

Thanks,

Henry

(e-mail address removed) remove 'zzz'

Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
Please do not send email directly to this e-mail address. It is for
newsgroup purposes only.

Find out everything about Microsoft Mac Newsgroups at:
[http://www.microsoft.com/mac/community/community.aspx?pid=newsgroups]
Check out product updates and news & info at:
[http://www.microsoft.com/mac]

Matt:

Thanks for your response on this thread:



Sorry, I should have said what I saw when I checked Tools-->Macro-->Macros:
Nada. No macros whatsoever, not in the current document, not in Normal, not
in "All Active templates and documents". (Despite the entreaties of people,
including MVPs to get me to define and use macros!) Of course "Word
Commands" has a whole bunch of 'em. I'm guessing (hoping) that a virus
can't be insinuated into that area.

Is that sufficient? I did check (and just rechecked) Word help, which
didn't seem to say anything about how to assure myself that I'm macro
virus-free. The KB has a lot of material, but not anything obviously
relevant.

I run NAV from time to time, and have _never_ detected any kind of
infection. But I'm not sure that any system-wide antivirus program can
detect a macro infection in a template.

Thanks,

Henry


(e-mail address removed) remove 'zzz'

 

[Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]]

Hey Henry, sorry for for the belated reply.

This indeed was an Apple issue however, it was fixed in MacOS 10.3.3, and
the problem was only with files located on a Server.

But if you're running 10.3.5, you 'should' be fine.

Are you accessing you're files locally?

Thanks for mentioning that it seems to only occur in long folder lists, that
kind of information is always helpful.

Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft

Jeffrey Weston:

Thanks for your post on this thread:

Hey Henry,

What version of MacOS are you running?

Sorry, this fell of the end of the thread, was in my original post: Word
2004, MacOS 10.3.5.

This could be an OS issue, so upgrading to the latest version of Panther
might fix it. (I'm not sure about Jaguar though...)

I sure wish I could upgrade and fix this...

Your response might be understood to confirm that a problem like this has
been reported before. Would you care to elaborate?

I've only seen such an issue when poking through long folder lists of mostly
Word files. This reflects both the longevity of the particular project
--which happens to be a pro bono, public service job-- and my practice of
saving Word documents very often. It might show up if I was working with
archives from other applications, but that doesn't happen for me.

Thanks,

Henry

(e-mail address removed) remove 'zzz'

Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
Please do not send email directly to this e-mail address. It is for
newsgroup purposes only.

Find out everything about Microsoft Mac Newsgroups at:
[http://www.microsoft.com/mac/community/community.aspx?pid=newsgroups]
Check out product updates and news & info at:
[http://www.microsoft.com/mac]

Matt:

Thanks for your response on this thread:

How do I prevent Word form changing a file modification date for a file
that I view and don't in any way modify?

You are quite right. If the document is being modified without your
being notified, something is very wrong. This sounds like the behavior
of a macro virus - it would modify your document as it is opened and
then immediately save it, so that you would not know of the change. m.

Thanks for the suggestion.

No macros shown in this file, and Preferences-->Security-->Warn before
opening a file that contains macros _is_ enabled.

Any other ideas?

The virus would not have to be in this file in order for the problem to
occur. It could be in any template in use at the time, including Normal.

Sorry, I should have said what I saw when I checked Tools-->Macro-->Macros:
Nada. No macros whatsoever, not in the current document, not in Normal, not
in "All Active templates and documents". (Despite the entreaties of people,
including MVPs to get me to define and use macros!) Of course "Word
Commands" has a whole bunch of 'em. I'm guessing (hoping) that a virus
can't be insinuated into that area.

Is that sufficient? I did check (and just rechecked) Word help, which
didn't seem to say anything about how to assure myself that I'm macro
virus-free. The KB has a lot of material, but not anything obviously
relevant.

I run NAV from time to time, and have _never_ detected any kind of
infection. But I'm not sure that any system-wide antivirus program can
detect a macro infection in a template.

Thanks,

Henry


(e-mail address removed) remove 'zzz'

m.