Using OneNote on several disconnected computers...

[dvjames]

Typically I would have one discussion for each question, but these questions
are all connected to using ON on disconnected computers. So up front, sorry
for the 3 questions here.

I keep my OneNote notebooks on a thumbdrive as the different computers I use
are not always able to connect. This works fine as ON keep track of changes
for me. However, I have several questions:

1. What happens is the thumbdrive fails? I know that I have copies of the
notebooks on each device and I am continuously syncing (thank you ON
developers). But what happens if the thumb drive fails? Having backed up on
each computer, restore backup files on one computer to a new thumbdrive then
resync the other computers? Will ON sync properly?

2. What folder stucture would you use for the documents from several
disconnected computers you insert into ON? I understand that you can keep any
documents attached from wherever they are on any computer that is synced, but
some kind of structure makes sense. I don't keep every document in ON, but I
am keeping more and more in it (it is addictive). Like any database, once you
create a folder structure and attach docs, you can't change it so getting the
folder structure right up front is important (please don't give me the
Apple-side of folder structure, I already know what an Apple can do and Apple
doesn't have OneNote).

Do you keep the attached documents in each notebook folder (which could end
up putting a staggering number of files in one folder and make it hard to
find the .one file) or do you keep a separate folder for the notebooks and
documents?

Each computer I use now has an important unique set of documents (word,
photoshop, etal). My toplevel structure is _OneNote (for notebooks) and
_OneNote Documents (for attached documents) in the My Documents folder. I
then have the OneNote Documents folder dividied into the kinds of notebooks I
keep (like Internal Projects, External Projects, Partners, etc.). I may have
a third level of folders under Partner such as the name of the partner.

3. When is the Thumbdrive going to be too small? The total so far is about
7MB, but I'm sure that someone has multiple GB in ON. Anyone else use ON like
this?

Just a statement: ON is a totally new kind of program in it's ability to
sync like this. There is something weirdly freeing and uncomplicated about
not having to worry about where your data is and what is happening to it -
you can have it with you (or not), you can update anytime you want no matter
how you are connected, and you can use any form of input you want (keyboard,
pen, or record) - right now I'm using a Motion Tablet. I've been using
computers for a long time and I don't remember any software product with
these abilities. I am still trying to get used to that fact. While I'm sure
there's errors and whatnot, it seems to do it seamlessly up to this point
100%.

;-)

 

[John Guin [msft]]

Hello.

1. If the drive dies, you still have your notebook in the cache of all your
machines. You can save it from there (as either .ONE or .ONEPKG files) and
restore whereever you want. Since you have multiple machines, you have (in
effect) multiple backups already. I had a similar eventhappen to me and I
wrote about it at
http://blogs.msdn.com/johnguin/archive/2008/03/07/still-living-in-the-onenote-cache.aspx



2. I've never worried about the folder structure once I choose a location
for a notebook. You mentioned attached (embedded) files in OneNote pages -
they are typically stored in a drive on the local machine. For instance, my
embedded files are at
C:\Users\John\AppData\Local\Microsoft\OneNote\12.0\OneNoteOfflineCache_Files
(on my vista machine). This is in addition to the .ONE file. And OneNote is
pretty resilient with moving folders around. Just right click on them after
moving and select "Open as Notebook in OneNote" if you feel the need to
restructure the files in the file system, but it's probably not worth the
effort.

3. My notebook on the flash device is about 250MB. The device is a 4GB
device, of which 2GB is devoted to ReadyBoost. So far, no problems. I have
a separate notebook on a USB device in which I took nothing but ink notes,
and it capped out at 150MB.

 

[dvjames]

Thank you for the reply. Great blog, btw. We've all been bitten by the
"wished I would have backed up" bug.

A few questions (I'm a NOOB with ON, so please forgive me ahead of time if I
ask something that's obvious - you know how it goes, people invent something
and the users end up devising a million ways to use in unanticipated ways):

1. Just relating to your emergency tactics - ON notebooks have to be open
for the notebooks to be in the cache (if your original drive where your core
ON files dies)? I keep multiple notebooks, not all of which are open at the
same time. I may not have the Personal Notebook open at work, for example.

2. Again on your tactics for drive failure - When you say you are "saving
the cache", are you talking about the physical cache in the Office folder
(default location) or are you talking about saving it from the open notebook.
I went down to the default cache location and while there is a notebook open,
there is no visible file there. I checked to see if I have all hidden files
showing and I do.

3. Backing up using OneNote - get all the notebooks open that you want to
back up, sync, then backup. What does backing up using OneNote get me over a
simple copy of the Thumbdrive? Does it make sure to gather up all the
attached files on that computer?

4. Backing up the thumbdrive - so I make sure to sync the files each time
and back those files up on a different drive or using home.live.com, my thumb
drive subsequently dies and I copy those files down to a new thumbdrive and
off I go. Right?

This is just a general question or a sense of wonderment at ON, I attach a
file at work, come home, click on the attached file and it opens. The way it
does this is somehow effortless and some of these are REALLY BIG files. Where
in the world does it save the attached files? Along with syncing, this
continues to amaze me because using ON is just simple and flexible once you
have a few of the basics down. I know there are limits and the more I use ON
I'll run into them, but a lot of times I'll just do what is logical and it
just works. The complex parts are behind the curtain. Please protect the
simplicity of this product!

Thanks again.

;-)

 

[John Guin [msft]]

1. Correct. You can also look in file | open backup for a day or two after
closing if you need to get to the OneNote created backup (for instance, if
you deleted the original .ONE file, or lost the thumbdrive which held it or
similar).

2. Saving it from the open notebook. Right click the notebook in OneNote
and select Save As...

3. Having an extra backup only gets you one mroe backup. I've had some USB
drives last for less than a year, and others that have been laundered many
times and still work fine. Having extra backups is always good.

4. Yes. Just copy the files from your most recent backup (if it ever comes
to that) and they will work fine.

Thanks for the kind words about my blog. And lastly, if there is one
comment we get over and over about Onenote, it is "keep it simple." We're
trying


--
Thanks,
John Guin
OneNote Test Team
http://blogs.msdn.com/johnguin

 

[dvjames]

I don't want to speak too soon about this, but I think that ON could be what
I think of as a killer ap. Some software comes out and it just changes the
way people use computers. Think about Visicalc. Think about Microsoft Word (I
started on a Mac and I think I still have a .5 BETA around here somewhere).
People will be buying computers just to use this. If I was Microsoft I would
just give this away.

I know what I'm talking about on this point. I bought a Motion Tablet (about
3 pounds) to use in meetings just to take notes and to test how I felt about
ON and computing WITHOUT a keyboard. Final answer: It is definately worth it.
Tapping (noise) on keys in a meeting is sometimes verboten and at the least
somewhat distracting (I type between 80-100 WPM so if I chose to type, I
could).

Penning definately captures what is being said faster (for me) because it
works with a different part of my brain. I also do my brainstorming with the
pen. Plus, the looks I get when I whip out a computer without a keyboard in
meetings is pretty cool too (OK I'm a geek - <g>).

I'm a director of marketing for a Microsoft Gold Certified Partner and I'd
be happy to do a business case study for ON.

 

[John Guin [msft]]

"I don't want to speak too soon about this, but I think that ON could be what
I think of as a killer ap."
----heh. I tend to agree.

Feel free to shoot me email via my blog. And I'm glad you like OneNote!

--
Thanks,
John Guin
OneNote Test Team
http://blogs.msdn.com/johnguin

 

[Rainald Taesler]

I don't want to speak too soon about this, but I think that ON
could be what I think of as a killer ap. Some software comes out
and it just changes the way people use computers. Think about
Visicalc. Think about Microsoft Word (I started on a Mac and I
think I still have a .5 BETA around here somewhere). People will be
buying computers just to use this. If I was Microsoft I would just
give this away.

LOL
But I think that so far there really has not been enough to promote ON.
It's a "killer app", for sure, but who knows it?
In our whole faculty so far no one is using ON - only because the
colleagues don't know it and have no imagination on how productive one
can be when using this fine piece of software.

I know what I'm talking about on this point. I bought a Motion
Tablet (about 3 pounds) to use in meetings just to take notes and
to test how I felt about ON and computing WITHOUT a keyboard.

Yes, ON is an ideal instrument for a TabletPC.
And the good thing is that it's not just a TabletPC app but most useful
on any desktop too.

Final
answer: It is definitely worth it. Tapping (noise) on keys in a
meeting is sometimes verboten and at the least somewhat distracting
(I type between 80-100 WPM so if I chose to type, I could).

It's not only the noise of the keys. The major thing is the atmosphere
in a meeting room where a third of the participants are fumbling around
with their notebooks. By the time using laptops during our faculty
conferences has become a NoNo - not officially "verboten" but everyone
feels that he is doing something wrong when opening his laptop.
Totally different with a TabletPC. It's not disturbing at all, just like
traditionally taking notes on paper.

Penning definately captures what is being said faster (for me)
because it works with a different part of my brain. I also do my
brainstorming with the pen. Plus, the looks I get when I whip out a
computer without a keyboard in meetings is pretty cool too (OK I'm
a geek - <g>).

LOL
Yes, at first colleagues are really curious when they first see me
opening the portfolio bag of my good old HP/COMPAQ tc1100 ( I always
leave the keyboard in the office when going to a meeting. And sometimes
the really fascinating when I quote from an old papers or the minutes of
a previous meeting. ;-) ;-).
Still I wonder why so far no one followed my "exotic" way.

Rainald

 

[dvjames]

I agree on the lack of promotion - seems it's all viral/word-of-mouth.

In a way that surprises me because ON 2007 is pretty solid, but maybe the
lack of promotion has allowed the ON developers to create without having a
lot of marketing guys (like me) make suggestions about adding features.

Loved the tc1100. Don't know why Compaq didn't continue with it.

;-)

 

[Rainald Taesler]

Loved the tc1100.

I still love it and use day-by-day - now happily running under Vista and
with new Bluetooth 2.0 module ;-)

Don't know why Compaq didn't continue with it.

Don't know. Maybe HP didn't like it because it was a COMPAQ.
The "hybrid" construction with the detachable keyboard was unique.
I did not yet find anything which might make a decent successor :-( :-(

Rainald

 

[dvjames]

The Motion 1700 Tablet is pretty good and can go to 4gb, but their attached
keyboard is make-do. If I need to use a keyboard, I set it up on a stand and
use an Apple Bluetooth keyboard and a Microsoft Bluetooth mouse. Or I could
use a USB keyboard and mouse. the tc1100 keyboard solution seems more
elegant.

 

[Rainald Taesler]

The Motion 1700 Tablet is pretty good and can go to 4gb,

I thought of this model too, already.

but their attached keyboard is make-do.

The description on Motion's website is a bit ambiguous. I would have to
see and touch it.
Too bad that nowadays things like that cannot be found in any store.

If I need to use a keyboard, I set it up on a stand and use an
Apple Bluetooth keyboard and a Microsoft Bluetooth mouse.
Or I could use a USB keyboard and mouse.

At home I mostly use the tc1100 in it's docking station with a wireless
Logitech diNovo keyboard + mouse.
When I travelling, I mostly take the detachable keyboard with me (just
in case).
In the office/lab I have a second tc1100 keyboard as well as an
AC-adapter.
When going from my lab to the lecture hall or a meeting, I mostly leave
the keyboard behind.

But I *always* have my mouse with me - it's the fantastic *MoGo* mouse.
It works Bluetooth and rests in the PCMCIA slot and its battery is
loaded
in there. I can highly recommend it. Pls see:
http://www.newtonperipherals.com/mogo_mouseBT.html
http://www.newtonperipherals.com/videos/mogomouse.com_1m10s.wmv
http://www.newtonperipherals.com/MogoMercial.htm
(also sold branded as "HP Card Mouse"
http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/12618_na/12618_na.HTML#Overview )

For presentations I use their "MoGo Presenter Mouse X54"
http://www.newtonperipherals.com/mogo_mouseX54pro.html ,
a really great device, with the drawback, however, of using an X54 port
(which I don't have so that it has to be loaded with an extra adapter).
But it
seems that now their "MoGo Presenter Mouse PC" for PCMCIA slots is
available.
http://mogostore.com/proddetail.asp?prod=MG104-0102
Seems that I have to order it right away ;-)

the tc1100 keyboard solution seems more elegant.

For sure it was "elegant" - especially in the "portfolio" bag.
But we wont get it back {siiiigh}.

Rainald
P.S. It seems that we have gone a bit OT :-(
Excuses to all others.