Word 2004 page length

[Guest]

I have just started working with this new version of Word. I have created a
form that fits very well on one page. When I send it to someone else with a
different version of Word the one page form takes up two pages. How can
this happen?! It is using the same font, single spacing, etc.

Thanks,
Rock

 

[Beth Rosengard]

Hi Rock,

The fact that the fonts have the same name doesn¹t mean they¹re the same
font. The only way you could be sure they¹re the same would be to send your
version of the font to the recipient and have him install it. And even
then, there are likely to be other differences that would produce the result
you¹re seeing, especially across platforms. The only way to be sure the
recipient sees exactly what you¹re seeing is to convert to PDF.

--
***Please always reply to the newsgroup!***

Beth Rosengard
Mac MVP

Mac Word FAQ: <http://word.mvps.org/MacWordNew/index.htm>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org>

 

[Elliott Roper]

Hi Rock,

The fact that the fonts have the same name doesn¹t mean they¹re the same
font. The only way you could be sure they¹re the same would be to send your
version of the font to the recipient and have him install it. And even
then, there are likely to be other differences that would produce the result
you¹re seeing, especially across platforms. The only way to be sure the
recipient sees exactly what you¹re seeing is to convert to PDF.

Not to mention a different printer at each end. All you need are
different printer drivers with differing notions of how close to the
edge of the page they can safely print and your carefully crafted
pagination is blown away.

 

[.]

This is a form that must be filled-out and it is important that it remains
relatively the same length. I understand that fonts, etc. can not always
match, but there is a big difference in the page I made-up using Word 2004.
I produced the exact form with Word 98 and it remained the same length, it
is only when I changed to Word 2004 that I get this problem, so I cannot see
why all of a sudden the fonts have anything to do with it.

Thanks again,
Rock

 

[Phillip M. Jones, CE.T.]

Hi Rock,

The fact that the fonts have the same name doesn’t mean they’re the same
font. The only way you could be sure they’re the same would be to send
your version of the font to the recipient and have him install it. And
even then, there are likely to be other differences that would produce
the result you’re seeing, especially across platforms. The only way to
be sure the recipient sees exactly what you’re seeing is to convert to PDF.

--
***Please always reply to the newsgroup!***

Beth Rosengard
Mac MVP

Mac Word FAQ: <http://word.mvps.org/MacWordNew/index.htm>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org>



On 10/21/04 8:03 AM, in article BD9D481A.13AF%[email protected],

I have just started working with this new version of Word. I have
created a form that fits very well on one page. When I send it to
someone else with a different version of Word the one page form
takes up two pages. How can this happen?! It is using the same
font, single spacing, etc.

Thanks,
Rock

the only fontes that are close to being identical is Arial, and Time
New Roman.

That said, though ....

if your a mac person sending to a PC person there will always be
differences.

The formula for this is Mac is based on 72DPI, PC 96DPI, or 100 DPI (not
as likely).

That means viewing a PC font and printing a Mac will be 72/96 as large
on the PC.
So a 12pt font from a PC looks like a 9 point font on the Mac. And 9
point font on a Mac look like a 12 point font on the PC.

While viewing a Mac Font on a PC will 96/72 as large on the PC. Also the
aspect ration of the fonts are different as well PC fonts tend to be
Taller and skinner. While Mac fonts tend to be almost but not quite
squarish in style. plus if exaimed with a Microsope PC fonts are very
tinny blocks that fit in a given patterm On the other hand Mac fonts
although usual silar patterns much like the graph line on Graph paper,
The use round dots that fit within thes blocks so that they don't appear
as jagged.

--
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Martinsville Va 24112-1809 |[email protected], ICQ11269732, AIM pjonescet
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If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!

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<http://vpea.exis.net>

 

[Elliott Roper]

This is a form that must be filled-out and it is important that it remains
relatively the same length. I understand that fonts, etc. can not always
match, but there is a big difference in the page I made-up using Word 2004.
I produced the exact form with Word 98 and it remained the same length, it
is only when I changed to Word 2004 that I get this problem, so I cannot see
why all of a sudden the fonts have anything to do with it.

Thanks again,
Rock

I should have added a little more.
Word does not try to make page breaks the same from machine to machine.
It does not bother with pagination till it comes to print. If the
printers at the two locations are different, or even the printer driver
margin settings are different, that is enough to make the form break in
a different place.

You could attempt to control where it breaks by selecting a few rows of
the form and choosing format->paragraph->line and page breaks->keep
with next. make the choice based on the printer with the smallest
printable area that will be likely to be involved.

If you really want the form to fall all on one page, make the fonts and
line spacing (leading) a good deal smaller so that there are generous
margins at the top, bottom and sides of the page. Then if the form
falls into the hands of someone with a printer that insists on heaps of
white space round the edges, it may still work.

Philip's advice about sticking to Times New Roman and Arial is worth
following. If you use a more esoteric font that is not installed on a
recipient's machine, you cannot guarantee that it won't make an
inappropriate font substitution and muck up the form again.

 

[Beth Rosengard]

Hi Rock,

You're talking about viewing the form on a monitor, not printing it, right?
Why are you assuming the fonts are the same from Word 2001 to Word 2004,
just because they're the same in Word 98? Many fonts changed in Word 2004
because of the addition of Unicode characters. Do you have any idea how
many versions of common fonts like Times New Roman or Arial there are? What
font are you using?

Try an experiment: Send the font you used to a Word 2004 user. Have him
install it in his own user folder (~/library/fonts) and if he has the
same-named font already in his user folder (other locations won't matter for
this experiment) have him disable it. Now have him open the form. Any
difference?

--
***Please always reply to the newsgroup!***

Beth Rosengard
Mac MVP

Mac Word FAQ: <http://word.mvps.org/MacWordNew/index.htm>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org>

 

[Beth Rosengard]

I should have added a little more.
Word does not try to make page breaks the same from machine to machine.
It does not bother with pagination till it comes to print. If the
printers at the two locations are different, or even the printer driver
margin settings are different, that is enough to make the form break in
a different place.

You could attempt to control where it breaks by selecting a few rows of
the form and choosing format->paragraph->line and page breaks->keep
with next. make the choice based on the printer with the smallest
printable area that will be likely to be involved.

If you really want the form to fall all on one page, make the fonts and
line spacing (leading) a good deal smaller so that there are generous
margins at the top, bottom and sides of the page. Then if the form
falls into the hands of someone with a printer that insists on heaps of
white space round the edges, it may still work.

Philip's advice about sticking to Times New Roman and Arial is worth
following. If you use a more esoteric font that is not installed on a
recipient's machine, you cannot guarantee that it won't make an
inappropriate font substitution and muck up the form again.

This is better advice than I just gave Rock. Thanks, Elliott. Especially
since I forgot about the influence of printer drivers even when not
printing.

However, I think the fonts do make a difference as well, even when they're
TNR or Arial. At least I remember in the old days when I upgraded from
Office 98 to 2001 that I had to try several versions of (just plain)
Helvetica before I found one that was identical to the old version. I
always assumed the same was true with today's standby fonts ­ TNR and Arial.
Is this not the case?

--
***Please always reply to the newsgroup!***

Beth Rosengard
Mac MVP

Mac Word FAQ: <http://word.mvps.org/MacWordNew/index.htm>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org>

 

[Elliott Roper]

However, I think the fonts do make a difference as well, even when they're
TNR or Arial. At least I remember in the old days when I upgraded from
Office 98 to 2001 that I had to try several versions of (just plain)
Helvetica before I found one that was identical to the old version. I
always assumed the same was true with today's standby fonts ­ TNR and Arial.
Is this not the case?

Probably less so, since TNR and Arial are Microsoft's own little
babies, and one must assume that they have gone to some trouble to get
the metrics right across platforms. Although just when you think you
understand what's happening in fontland, something throws another curve
ball. Probably called Unicode. ;-)

Helvetica is much more likely to be problematic. There are literally
dozens of those floating about. You gotta keep at least one though. How
else can one be snobby about Arial? I bet most people can't tell Arial
from Helvetica. (hint - a and t - show the bigest differences in the
regular face)

I have just been throught the same hassle with Garamond. I finally
settled on Adobe Garamond Pro. It looks great for printing and
distributing PDFs, but hardly anybody I work with either has it or
wants it. So I made style variants based on Arial and TNR, just so I
can let other people edit my work. I really really hate Times in all
its forms. If ever there was a font that says "pointy-haired-boss",
Times is it.

 

[Beth Rosengard]

Thanks, Elliot.

I hate the Times fonts too although that may be largely because I dislike
serif fonts in general. I'm one of those who really doesn't mind Arial (and
Helvetica ­ and, no, I can't tell the difference except that the same
sentence typed in Helvetica is a tiny bit shorter). It may be boring but I
find it easier to read than the alternatives.

Beth

 

[Phillip M. Jones, CE.T.]

Probably less so, since TNR and Arial are Microsoft's own little
babies, and one must assume that they have gone to some trouble to get
the metrics right across platforms. Although just when you think you
understand what's happening in fontland, something throws another curve
ball. Probably called Unicode. ;-)

Helvetica is much more likely to be problematic. There are literally
dozens of those floating about. You gotta keep at least one though. How
else can one be snobby about Arial? I bet most people can't tell Arial
from Helvetica. (hint - a and t - show the bigest differences in the
regular face)

I have just been throught the same hassle with Garamond. I finally
settled on Adobe Garamond Pro. It looks great for printing and
distributing PDFs, but hardly anybody I work with either has it or
wants it. So I made style variants based on Arial and TNR, just so I
can let other people edit my work. I really really hate Times in all
its forms. If ever there was a font that says "pointy-haired-boss",
Times is it.

Helvetica was at one time Top dog on Mac, and Arial was MS attempt at
mimicking it. Then Apple came out with their version of Arial.

--
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Martinsville Va 24112-1809 |[email protected], ICQ11269732, AIM pjonescet
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!

mailto[email protected]

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<http://vpea.exis.net>

 

[Phillip M. Jones, CE.T.]

I find the bestfont for me to read, I have ever come across is ITC Benguait.

A lot of the computer help books in stores are actually printed in it.

If printed in 12 or 14 pt it very easy on the eyes. And the way its
designed its shap has enough interest to it to keep you from zoning out
when read a large document. I'm lucy to get past two pages of anything
published in Helvetica without nodding off.

Thanks, Elliot.

I hate the Times fonts too although that may be largely because I dislike
serif fonts in general. I'm one of those who really doesn't mind Arial (and
Helvetica ­ and, no, I can't tell the difference except that the same
sentence typed in Helvetica is a tiny bit shorter). It may be boring but I
find it easier to read than the alternatives.

Beth

--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phillip M. Jones, CET |MEMBER:VPEA (LIFE) ETA-I, NESDA,ISCET, Sterling
616 Liberty Street |Who's Who. PHONE:276-632-5045, FAX:276-632-0868
Martinsville Va 24112-1809 |[email protected], ICQ11269732, AIM pjonescet
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!

mailto[email protected]

<http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/default.htm>
<http://home.kimbanet.com/~pjones/birthday/index.htm>
<http://vpea.exis.net>

 

[Beth Rosengard]

Hi Phillip,

First, thank you for top posting ! I know you dislike doing so, but I've
always wondered why you bottom post when a thread has been trending upwards
for several posts in a row. It makes reading very difficult and this way is
so much more logical under the circumstances. (I'm not looking for a
top/bottom posting debate here; just a simple thanks for top posting when
the situation warrants .)

Yes, I've been told about ITC Benguiat before but IIRC I checked it out
online and it was not a free font. I didn't feel like paying for it when I
already had perfectly sufficient fonts .

--
***Please always reply to the newsgroup!***

Beth Rosengard
Mac MVP

Mac Word FAQ: <http://word.mvps.org/MacWordNew/index.htm>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org>

 

[Phillip M. Jones, CE.T.]

The reason why I forget to top post here is because I have been all but
threatened with bodily harm if I do so on any of the Netscape/Mozilla
news groups. It seems that everyone there are stuck in the 70's back
when Bulletin Boards got started and refuse to get into the 21st century.

Even the Mac newsgroups in which the Netscape/Mozilla Champions, had
encouraged Top posting for efficiency, have been overruled and told you
either tow the line or your out.

So when everyone else is bottom posting I've had to learn to do. So now
when I go to a group that allows top posting I forget. :-(

Hi Phillip,

First, thank you for top posting ! I know you dislike doing so, but I've
always wondered why you bottom post when a thread has been trending upwards
for several posts in a row. It makes reading very difficult and this way is
so much more logical under the circumstances. (I'm not looking for a
top/bottom posting debate here; just a simple thanks for top posting when
the situation warrants .)

Yes, I've been told about ITC Benguiat before but IIRC I checked it out
online and it was not a free font. I didn't feel like paying for it when I
already had perfectly sufficient fonts .

--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phillip M. Jones, CET |MEMBER:VPEA (LIFE) ETA-I, NESDA,ISCET, Sterling
616 Liberty Street |Who's Who. PHONE:276-632-5045, FAX:276-632-0868
Martinsville Va 24112-1809 |[email protected], ICQ11269732, AIM pjonescet
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!

mailto[email protected]

<http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/default.htm>
<http://home.kimbanet.com/~pjones/birthday/index.htm>
<http://vpea.exis.net>