Confirm Thank You is seen by contributor (e.g.,John Vinson)

[JoanOC]

I am not sure that John Vinson saw my thank you for 30 or so posts between us
in which he solved my problem.
I think the green check mark indicates the question has been answered.
I have indicated that many of my questions were answered, but don't see any
green check mark on some of them. Especially, the aforementioned postings.
2) Is it possible to direct a question to one MVP?
Love this site. Very helpful and professional.

 

[Douglas J. Steele]

Actually, John's just gone off for a few days of well-deserved r&r, so he
may not have seen your thank you.

Few (if any) of the MVPs use the web-interface, so the check marks and stuff
like that are foreign to us.

Directing questions to specific individuals (be they MVPs or not) is
generally not encouraged, if only because it's really of less benefit to
you. The individual in question has to check the newsgroup, find time to
reply, etc., whereas if you don't address it to a specific individual,
someone else may be able to answer your question.

 

[JoanOC]

Thanks for your reply and clarification. I thought MVPs were individuals who
signed on just like me. I am the first to agree that John deseres r&r after
our 30 threads.
You all are a great help. Keep up the good work.
Joan

 

[Jeff Conrad]

in message:

Thanks for your reply and clarification. I thought MVPs were individuals who
signed on just like me. I am the first to agree that John deserves r&r after
our 30 threads.
You all are a great help. Keep up the good work.

The signing on process through the web interface is only a recent
innovation by Microsoft.

 

['69 Camaro]

Hi, Joan.

I think the green check mark indicates the question has been answered.

You are correct.

I have indicated that many of my questions were answered, but don't see
any
green check mark on some of them.

Microsoft's Online Community Discussion Groups Web site is buggy. If you
marked a post as an answer while signed in and the green check mark doesn't
appear after a screen refresh, then the post is only identified as
"helpful," not an "answer," and will be purged from the database in six
months or less, unless two-thirds of at least three members of the Online
Community also mark it as helpful, or one of the other posts in the
discussion thread is marked as an answer or meets these same requirements.
It's unlikely that Microsoft's Web Team is going to fix this intermittent
problem.

If you want a post to be marked as an answer to your question, then you must
sign in, find the post and mark it again until a green check mark appears on
the post after the next screen refresh.

Due to the bugs in Microsoft's Web site, it's questionable whether John or
any other contributor is guaranteed to get credit for posts rated as the
answer by the person who posted the original question. It appears that a
number of these green check-marked answers are only getting credit as
"helpful" posts in Microsoft's database, but Microsoft.com Customer Support
assures me that they are researching the matter.

2) Is it possible to direct a question to one MVP?

Some of the MVP's are consultants. If one hires a consultant, then one may
use that consultant exclusively if so desired, but that would be outside the
realm of the newsgroups. However, the purpose of the newsgroups is
peer-to-peer assistance so that the most people can benefit from finding
solutions that have previously been resolved by others.

Love this site. Very helpful and professional.

The Web site you are using is a Web portal that deposits and retrieves
messages into UseNet, which anyone with an Internet connection can use to
post questions and answers in previously-defined discussion groups, commonly
called newsgroups. The person responding to you may be your neighbor or
someone located on another continent, who is familiar with your problem, and
who is volunteering to help you solve it. Respondents to your questions are
very unlikely to be from Microsoft or affiliated in any way with the Web
site you are currently using. Respondents to your questions are also very
unlikely to use the Web site that you are using.

HTH.

Gunny

See http://www.QBuilt.com for all your database needs.
See http://www.Access.QBuilt.com for Microsoft Access tips.

(Please remove ZERO_SPAM from my reply E-mail address, so that a message
will be forwarded to me.)
Beware to those who use munged addresses: known newsgroup E-mail harvesters
for spammers are (e-mail address removed) and (e-mail address removed)

 

[Dirk Goldgar]

Microsoft's Online Community Discussion Groups Web site is buggy. If
you marked a post as an answer while signed in and the green check
mark doesn't appear after a screen refresh, then the post is only
identified as "helpful," not an "answer," and will be purged from the
database in six months or less, unless two-thirds of at least three
members of the Online Community also mark it as helpful, or one of
the other posts in the discussion thread is marked as an answer or
meets these same requirements. It's unlikely that Microsoft's Web
Team is going to fix this intermittent problem.

Gunny, where are you getting this information? To the best of my
knowledge, and I asked about this recently, MS are not purging
"non-answers" from their news servers. All messages do "age off the
server" after a certain period of time, but that happens regardless of
whether a post is marked as an answer, or helpful, or any other kind of
marking done by the web newsreader.

Due to the bugs in Microsoft's Web site, it's questionable whether
John or any other contributor is guaranteed to get credit for posts
rated as the answer by the person who posted the original question.
It appears that a number of these green check-marked answers are only
getting credit as "helpful" posts in Microsoft's database, but
Microsoft.com Customer Support assures me that they are researching
the matter.

I was also told that MS doesn't use the webnews "response ratings" to
evaluate candidates for the MVP award, probably (IMO) because there are
so many people don't use the web newsreader, but prefer their newsgroups
straight. <g>

 

['69 Camaro]

Hi, Dirk.

Gunny, where are you getting this information?

From Microsoft's Web site. Go to the last page of any newsgroup and page
forward. Look at the dates of the posts and how the posts have been marked.
Answered questions, suggestions to Microsoft, and unanswered questions from
the special categories are still there after six months. Ordinary
unanswered questions are not.

To the best of my
knowledge, and I asked about this recently, MS are not purging
"non-answers" from their news servers. All messages do "age off the
server" after a certain period of time

Perhaps "purging" isn't the right word, since it connotes actively clearing
or getting rid of these messages. At a certain age (currently six months),
ordinary unanswered questions in the database are no longer retrievable from
the Web site. Perhaps Microsoft keeps these for in-house use, but they
aren't available to the general public. (If these posts aren't retrievable,
then for our purposes Microsoft essentially "got rid" of them.) If a
discussion thread is to be retrievable by the general public from the Web
site after six months, it needs to have at least one reply rated as an
answer or else fall into one of the special categories.

but that happens regardless of
whether a post is marked as an answer, or helpful, or any other kind of
marking done by the web newsreader.

The discussion threads with replies rated as answers or that fall into one
of the special categories haven't aged off the server yet, so that age is at
least 10 months. More likely, it's a year or more. It depends upon how
much disk space Microsoft has reserved for this project, but I would expect
there to be enough disk space to keep correct answers for at least three
years. (Not that Microsoft has ever listened to my recommendation.)

I was also told that MS doesn't use the webnews "response ratings" to
evaluate candidates for the MVP award

That's probably a good thing because the system is so buggy that it can't
really be used for fair evaluations. Was it the MVP Lead who told you this?
Then what _is_ used to evaluate candidates, or is that a Microsoft secret?

probably (IMO) because there are
so many people don't use the web newsreader, but prefer their newsgroups
straight. <g>

Last time I checked, more than 70% of threads in the Access newgroups were
initiated from Microsoft's Web portal, so eventually there's going to be
more postings from the Web portal than from regular news readers. <Sigh>
Maybe Microsoft will fix some more of the bugs by then.

HTH.

Gunny

See http://www.QBuilt.com for all your database needs.
See http://www.Access.QBuilt.com for Microsoft Access tips.

(Please remove ZERO_SPAM from my reply E-mail address, so that a message
will be forwarded to me.)
Beware to those who use munged addresses: known newsgroup E-mail harvesters
for spammers are (e-mail address removed) and (e-mail address removed)

 

[Joan Wild]

(If these posts aren't retrievable, then for our purposes
Microsoft essentially "got rid" of them.) If a discussion thread is
to be retrievable by the general public from the Web site after six
months, it needs to have at least one reply rated as an answer or
else fall into one of the special categories.

That's why Google Groups search is the preferred method to search older
answers.

Then what _is_ used to evaluate candidates, or is that
a Microsoft secret?

It is not known if or what any quantitative information they use. They look
for individuals who consistently over a period of time contribute to
communities. See https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs for more
information.

Last time I checked, more than 70% of threads in the Access newgroups
were initiated from Microsoft's Web portal, so eventually there's
going to be more postings from the Web portal than from regular news
readers. <Sigh> Maybe Microsoft will fix some more of the bugs by
then.

Maybe, but the people who are regulars and providing most of the answers, do
not use the Web portal.

 

['69 Camaro]

Hi, Joan.

That's why Google Groups search is the preferred method to search older
answers.

Agreed. But Google Groups searches reveal information in posts either by
date or by an algorithm defining the highest degree of relevance. There may
be a correct answer in the dozens of threads retrieved by the search, but
there's no way to find it other than to read each post until it's found.
Having answers marked by those who have already found the solution is a big
plus.

It is not known if or what any quantitative information they use. They
look for individuals who consistently over a period of time contribute to
communities. See https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs for more
information.

Thanks. The FAQ isn't very comforting to those who have consistently
contributed excellent answers for years, not just the previous year's
contributions as mentioned in the FAQ, yet still haven't made the cut. Look
at Rick Brandt, Tom Wickerath, and Jeff Conrad for starters. One wonders
what they are missing or who they have ticked off that prevents them from
getting selected. Is there some quota system and Microsoft has decided that
there are already enough Access MVP's?

Maybe, but the people who are regulars and providing most of the answers,
do not use the Web portal.

Good thing. Have you noticed that there have been hardly _any_ new
questions in the last four hours? Microsoft's Web portal has been down this
afternoon. Again.

Gunny

See http://www.QBuilt.com for all your database needs.
See http://www.Access.QBuilt.com for Microsoft Access tips.

(Please remove ZERO_SPAM from my reply E-mail address, so that a message
will be forwarded to me.)
Beware to those who use munged addresses: known newsgroup E-mail harvesters
for spammers are (e-mail address removed) and (e-mail address removed)

 

[Joan Wild]

Hi Gunny,

Just to add to what Brendan has said, I know of MVPs who posted for four
years before getting awarded. Also there are MVPs awarded who don't ever
enter the newsgroups; they've been awarded for their participation in other
communities (User Groups, for example).

 

[Dirk Goldgar]

Hi, Dirk.


From Microsoft's Web site. Go to the last page of any newsgroup and
page forward. Look at the dates of the posts and how the posts have
been marked. Answered questions, suggestions to Microsoft, and
unanswered questions from the special categories are still there
after six months. Ordinary unanswered questions are not.

Interesting. I see the phenomenon, but I'm not convinced that it has
its boundary at six months. At least, looking at
microsoft.public.access, it seems to happen sometime in September, not
in November. Maybe it says "six months" somewhere, but I don't see it.
I've now read the help file on the web newsreader, so I see where some
of your information is coming from, but I don't see where the retention
period is spelled out. Maybe there's a volume limit, rather than a date
limit, or some combination of the two.

Oddly, even before the September boundary, I see a good number of
threads with no rating of any kind. I'm a little puzzled at their
presence, given what the help window says about retention.

Perhaps "purging" isn't the right word, since it connotes actively
clearing or getting rid of these messages. At a certain age
(currently six months), ordinary unanswered questions in the database
are no longer retrievable from the Web site. Perhaps Microsoft keeps
these for in-house use, but they aren't available to the general
public. (If these posts aren't retrievable, then for our purposes
Microsoft essentially "got rid" of them.) If a discussion thread is
to be retrievable by the general public from the Web site after six
months, it needs to have at least one reply rated as an answer or
else fall into one of the special categories.

I agree that there's a serious problem with the general public, who are
led to believe that the web newsreader is the only message repository,
and thus don't realize that helpful messages may be out there but not
available via the web interface. I fear that this policy by Microsoft,
however well-intended or driven by practical requirements, may

Was it the MVP Lead who
told you this? Then what _is_ used to evaluate candidates, or is that
a Microsoft secret?

I believe they use Google to identify candidates, followed by individual
evaluation of those candidates. That only applies to people who are
candidates due to their newsgroup activities, of course.

Last time I checked, more than 70% of threads in the Access newgroups
were initiated from Microsoft's Web portal, so eventually there's
going to be more postings from the Web portal than from regular news
readers. <Sigh> Maybe Microsoft will fix some more of the bugs by
then.

I sure hope they do. Although the concept behind te web portal -- the
ability to identify posts that are likely to be helpful -- is a good
one, the implementation is currently intolerable, at least for anyone
who is accustomed to a real newsreader.

 

[Dirk Goldgar]

Thanks. The FAQ isn't very comforting to those who have consistently
contributed excellent answers for years, not just the previous year's
contributions as mentioned in the FAQ, yet still haven't made the
cut.

The award is made on an annual basis, so years of contribution, alas,
mean nothing. I'd like to think that some consideration is given to
current MVPs, but I have absolutely no confirmation of that.

Look at Rick Brandt, Tom Wickerath, and Jeff Conrad for
starters.

Or '69 Camaro.

One wonders what they are missing or who they have ticked
off that prevents them from getting selected. Is there some quota
system and Microsoft has decided that there are already enough Access
MVP's?

You get no argument from me on the qualifications of any of the people
you mentioned. I really don't think there's any chance they have missed
anything, or annoyed any of the PTB. Despite the expansion of the MVP
program from a few years ago, though, I assume there's a limit on the
number of MVPs MS wants to recognize and award. Who knows, maybe MS
will adopt a policy of cycling the award among the eligible candidates.
That might be fair. I'd hate to lose my MVP status to such a move,
because it tickles my fancy and lets me interact with a great bunch of
people, but I never sought it, was surprised when I got it, and won't
behave any differently if I cease to be an MVP.

 

[Fred Boer]

Hi Dirk, et. al. :

anything, or annoyed any of the PTB. Despite the expansion of the MVP
program from a few years ago, though, I assume there's a limit on the
number of MVPs MS wants to recognize and award. Who knows, maybe MS

Interestingly, there's quite a variation in the numbers of MVPs :

Access - 53
Word - 22
Excel - 36
SQL Server - 82
Visual Basic - 132
Asp.NET - 202

This whole topic makes for fascinating reading! Obviously the selection
process is a complete and bewildering mystery... It reminds me of
something... what could it be? Wait! Do they send up clouds of white smoke
when they've reached a verdict??

people, but I never sought it, was surprised when I got it, and won't
behave any differently if I cease to be an MVP.

I feel exactly the same, Dirk! Exactly the same....... well, I suppose there
is one small difference...

Fred Boer

 

[Brendan Reynolds]

It's probably a good thing that the selection process is not publicly
documented. If it was, it might be tempting to tailor one's activities to
the process. If that practise became widespread, MVP status would become a
prize in a competition rather than an award for helpfulness. Because the
process is not documented, all one can do is try to be helpful. Hopefully,
it is the end users seeking answers to their questions who will be the
winners in this situation!

 

[Fred Boer]

Dear Brendan:

Perhaps it is good for that particular reason, but I suppose the drawback is
that the process will seem rather arbitrary! It brings to my mind the image
of a group of young women lined up along the wall at a school dance waiting
eagerly for someone to invite them onto the floor, wondering what motivates
the young men...

Cheers
Fred

Hmm...now I have an image of Access MVPs and MVP hopefuls lined up along the
wall with Bill Gates or Steve Ballmer as the suitors... Eeew... it's all
getting kinda wierd, now.....!

 

[John Vinson]

Wait! Do they send up clouds of white smoke
when they've reached a verdict??

Some has been seen coming out of the ears of nominees when they're
notified, yes.

John W. Vinson[MVP]

 

[Brendan Reynolds]

They were waiting eagerly? Damn! If only I'd known ...

--
Brendan Reynolds (MVP)

Dear Brendan:

Perhaps it is good for that particular reason, but I suppose the drawback
is that the process will seem rather arbitrary! It brings to my mind the
image of a group of young women lined up along the wall at a school dance
waiting eagerly for someone to invite them onto the floor, wondering what
motivates the young men...

<snip>

 

[Larry Linson]

Interestingly, there's quite a variation in the numbers of MVPs :

Access - 53
Word - 22
Excel - 36
SQL Server - 82
Visual Basic - 132
Asp.NET - 202

Fred,

Recent changes have resulted in their not being a complete, current,
publicly available list of MVPs any more. Only those MVPs who have entered
"profile information" and agreed for it to be displayed publicly are listed,
now. There have been more than 53 Access MVPs for several years.

It's not surprising to me that there are relatively more MVPs for ASP.NET --
ASP.NET is an area of considerable emphasis for Microsoft, both in
development and marketing.

Larry Linson
Microsoft Access MVP

 

[Fred Boer]

Ah, well, I didn't know that.. I thought the list at Microsoft.com was
definitive... thanks!
You might be right about the reason for so many Asp.Net MVPS... but I like
to think that any one Access MVP can lick his or her weight in Asp.NET
MVPs... ! <g>

Fred Boer

 

[Fred Boer]

Well, I *thought* they were. My parents believed dancing was immoral and
sinful, and I was forbidden from going to high school dances. I always
*imagined* the walls were lined with eager girls...

Cheers!
Fred