J
jan
Exactly!
It's a newsgroup - but more like a zombie newsgroup.
I don't think anyone from the Outlook side answered.
Exactly!
It's a newsgroup - but more like a zombie newsgroup.
I don't think anyone from the Outlook side answered.
F
FromTheRafters
Yeah, like BD said, most of the "helpers" from those groups went to web
based "Microsoft Answers" instead. Many , if not most, of said
"helpers" even there do not actually work for Microsoft but volunteer
their time to help.
R
R. C. White
Hi, Jan.
In 2010, Microsoft shut down its Microsoft Public news server, which was the
"Mother Ship" for all the thousands of newsgroups in the microsoft.public.*
hierarchy. But those NGs were mirrored by hundreds (thousands?) of news
servers around the world. Microsoft does not own or control Usenet. SOME
of those non-MSFT servers honored the request to drop the NGs, but many
continue to carry them. Some of the news servers are free; others require a
subscription. You can find thousands by searching for "free news servers".
My own ISP (Grande Communications, Inc.) bundles access to a news server
(Giganews) with my Internet cable subscription. So, while access to the
server feels to me like it's free, it really isn't because it's included in
my monthly fee.
As of today, Grande's news server includes access to well over 100,000 NGs,
including nearly 4,000 (in many languages) whose names start with
microsoft.public, including microsoft.public.outlook - which is where I am
reading and Replying to your post. Some NGs have only current content, but
some have archives with posts dating back decades.
So your posts and mine are posted and available in Usenet, although
Microsoft has nothing to do with them anymore.
RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2012 (Build 16.4.3508.0205) in Win8 Pro
"jan" wrote in message
Hmmmmmmm... what happens to the posts that go to
microsoft.public.outlook then?
Do they not get posted?
In 2010, Microsoft shut down its Microsoft Public news server, which was the
"Mother Ship" for all the thousands of newsgroups in the microsoft.public.*
hierarchy. But those NGs were mirrored by hundreds (thousands?) of news
servers around the world. Microsoft does not own or control Usenet. SOME
of those non-MSFT servers honored the request to drop the NGs, but many
continue to carry them. Some of the news servers are free; others require a
subscription. You can find thousands by searching for "free news servers".
My own ISP (Grande Communications, Inc.) bundles access to a news server
(Giganews) with my Internet cable subscription. So, while access to the
server feels to me like it's free, it really isn't because it's included in
my monthly fee.
As of today, Grande's news server includes access to well over 100,000 NGs,
including nearly 4,000 (in many languages) whose names start with
microsoft.public, including microsoft.public.outlook - which is where I am
reading and Replying to your post. Some NGs have only current content, but
some have archives with posts dating back decades.
So your posts and mine are posted and available in Usenet, although
Microsoft has nothing to do with them anymore.
RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2012 (Build 16.4.3508.0205) in Win8 Pro
"jan" wrote in message
Hmmmmmmm... what happens to the posts that go to
microsoft.public.outlook then?
Do they not get posted?
V
VanguardLH
Danny said:
Oh, so you never did get Office for free. You PAID for it as an option
included in your hardware configuration.
V
VanguardLH
jan said:That's untrue.
You can download all versions of Microsoft Office, from Microsoft, for free.
You just need a product key in order to make them work.
Stop confusing the issue. You ARE cross-posting in the
alt.comp.freeware newsgroup. Free downloading is NOT the same as FREE
software. You can downloads lots of payware (commercial, shareware,
trialware) for free from lots of sites but that does NOT alter the
licensing for the software itself.
Free download DOES NOT EQUAL free software.
K
Ken Blake, MVP
That's untrue.
You can download all versions of Microsoft Office, from Microsoft, for free.
You just need a product key in order to make them work.
Yes, see Vanguard's reply and my reply to him.
K
Ken Blake, MVP
Microsoft stopped supporting the newsgroups they had started. But they
can't stop the many news servers around the world from continuing to
carry them.
V
VanguardLH
jan said:
The download won't differentiate between retail and OEM versions. The
product key does that. I don't have Office 2007 but I'm sure Microsoft
has an online copy somewhere. For Office 2003, its online EULA is at:
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=22396
which says:
1.1 GRANT OF LICENSE. Microsoft grants you the following rights
provided that you comply with all terms and conditions of this EULA:
...
(b) install an additional copy of the Software on a second, portable
device for the exclusive use of the primary user of the first copy of
the Software.
Microsoft lets you install on a second computer but only for the PRIMARY
user. That's probably you, not your kid. The license (via product key)
you give your kid must be:
- Retail version (full or upgrade) that is not currently installed
anywhere else. You'll be transferring the entire license to your kid.
- OEM version that has *never* been installed. Again, you'll be
donating the complete license to your kid for his sole use.
- Not a prior version on which an later installed upgrade version is
based. If Office 2003 was the prior version upon which an Office 2007
upgrade version is based, and if Office 2007 is installed anywhere,
then you lose the license to Office 2003. Upgrade licensing requires
a complete chain of licenses from a full license through all upgrade
licenses to the last one. An upgrade license obviates a prior license
on which the upgrade is based.
In any case, you will lose all legitimate access to the license (and any
upgrade licenses thereafter). You don't get to use that license
anymore. Your kid has the license, not you. If it's an OEM license,
and once installed on your kid's computer, you'll never be able to use
that license again, and your kid will only be able to use it with his
current computer.
No, Microsoft isn't going to send out its License Police to arrest you;
however, you do agree to the licensing terms when you choose to install
or leave installed their software. It's a contract to which you chose
to agree.
Just be sure you have the licensing okay with your kid. Since this is
his school computer ("junior year overseas"), you certainly don't want
your kid to loss use of the software through some deactivation process
that Microsoft might come up with. If there are any dubious handling of
the Office licenses, you might just tell your kid to get LibreOffice
which is free. If he doesn't use Office macros then everything he does
in Office is likely doable in LibreOffice (the supported version of the
defunct OpenOffice product after Oracle acquired it from Sun and then
dumped it 2 years later on the Apache Software Foundation).
V
VanguardLH
jan said:
I suspect you searched the wrong newsgroup. The general discussion for
Outlook is at:
microsoft.public.outlook.general
The parent newsgroup of microsoft.public.outlook (15K posts) doesn't get
as much traffic as the child microsoft.public.outlook.general newsgroup
(67K posts). Also, if you post in a child newsgroup then you should not
also be [cross-]posting to the parent group. Post in the parent or the
child but not both.
Perhaps there were few discussions in the Outlook [general] newsgroup
about Outlook missing from the Home & Student editions of Office
2007/2010/2013 because those owners were already aware their choice of
the low-end edition omitted that component. They wouldn't be asking
about a missing Outlook if they already knew it would be missing. Also,
as you yourself noted, there is no standalone backup download from
Microsoft for Outlook, so why would those newsgroups discuss a download
that doesn't exist? For backup downloads of *Office*, did you check the
history of posts over in the microsoft.public.office.misc newsgroup?
Did YOU ask over in an *Office* newsgroup on where to get the backup
downloads from Microsoft?
D
Danny D.
VanguardLH said:
Actually, I got it for free since they sent the retail
version (which came with its own 25-character key) whereas
what I had bought was something completely different.
I had bought a Dell PC with an OEM-installed Microsoft Office 2010
Home and Student on it, which ostensibly cost me $119 (according
to Dell) out of the $500 or so that I had paid for the PC.
When I had called Dell for the backup disc, they told me to go
to Microsoft. When I called Microsoft for the backup disc, they
told me to go to Dell (because my product ID had "OEM" in the
sequence).
Catch 22.
I complained. Repeatedly. To both Dell & Microsoft.
At some point, the "special" telephone number I mentioned
came up, and, when I finally complained to *them*, they decided
to get rid of me (I guess) by just sending me an entire new
retail backup version of the disc, which was *not* locked
to the PC.
So, in effect, *I* got Microsoft Office for free; but it cost
me a *lot* of phone calls!
J
jan
Actually our backup plan was to consider the $99 office 360 route -
but - hopefully won't need to go that way since the office 2003 worked.
I say hopefully because my kid reported early this morning that
the Office 2003 link seemed to decompress a bunch of CAB files but then
never appeared with an installation executable.
So, we're not sure if this is a valid download of Office 2003, or not:
http://download.microsoft.com/download/6/2/3/6233A257-16BD-4C8DBF4C-6FA59AF9213A/OfficeSTD.exe
Which was suggested in this Microsoft help page:
http://preview.tinyurl.com/m9ggpua
P
Paul
jan said:
<< alt.comp.freeware removed >>
I have a copy of that file on disk. At least, it has the
same name as that.
227,190,984 bytes
MD5SUM = 6171a3e1ec8cf056dc77d8052ba18a86 *officestd.exe
Description: Microsoft Office Standard Edition 2003 Self-Extracting Installer
File Version: 11.0.5614.0
Date Created: 6/18/2012 7:00 A.M.
Size: 216MB
It does have a setup.exe in it.
Try unpacking with 7-ZIP.
http://imageshack.us/a/img801/8998/1kf6.gif
Also, just above that file, is "setup.chm_1033".
Extract that, rename to "setup.chm", double click it to
see a help dialog.
Paul
B
~BD~
jan said:
Ken Blake MVP is an adviser in the MS 'Outlook' group!
V
VanguardLH
Danny said:Actually, I got it for free since they sent the retail
version (which came with its own 25-character key) whereas
what I had bought was something completely different.
I had bought a Dell PC with an OEM-installed Microsoft Office 2010
Home and Student on it, which ostensibly cost me $119 (according
to Dell) out of the $500 or so that I had paid for the PC.
When I had called Dell for the backup disc, they told me to go
to Microsoft. When I called Microsoft for the backup disc, they
told me to go to Dell (because my product ID had "OEM" in the
sequence).
Catch 22.
I complained. Repeatedly. To both Dell & Microsoft.
At some point, the "special" telephone number I mentioned
came up, and, when I finally complained to *them*, they decided
to get rid of me (I guess) by just sending me an entire new
retail backup version of the disc, which was *not* locked
to the PC.
So, in effect, *I* got Microsoft Office for free; but it cost
me a *lot* of phone calls!
OEM. That means you resolve issues with the OEM. That would be Dell no
matter how much they would like to divert you elsewhere. They have to
support ALL the fluff they install on the OS. It's their setup.
They're the OEM. No catch 22. Just a stupid call rep.
V
VanguardLH
jan said:
I'll assume you meant Office 365.
That would be the *subscription* price EVERY year of $99.99 or $9.99/mo.
Microsoft is going to subscriptionware. They've start with their Office
product. Rumors are they will do the same with Windows.
A comparison of major features (components) is listed at:
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/buy/compare-microsoft-office-products-FX102898564.aspx
With an average development cycle of 4 years, you would come out ahead
on price *if* you upgraded to the new version every time Microsoft
wanted to push one out, usually by changing its UI to pretend it's a
major new version. An old marketing ploy: make the same old stuff with
minor changes look different. However, many Office users retain use of
their old versions for a lot longer. I'd still be using Office 2003 if
it weren't for an OEM version that came along with a used computer given
to me for free by a buddy of mine (that I had to repair but got it
working just fine). Even then, I only moved from Office XP (2002)
because I saved a search at eBay with a max price of $40. I wasn't
going to pay more than that since all the new stuff really didn't
improve *my* use of the product. So other than fortuitous
circumstances, I'd still be back on Office XP. I don't remember what I
paid for Office XP (or if I paid anything since I get so many perks at
seminars or when I contract to a new company), but if I had paid
$100/year for a subscription then I would've paid $1300 by now, and I
still probably use only 60% of all of its functions, if that.
Rather than waste more money on later versions of Office whether as a
local client, cloud assisted client, or whatever they come up with next,
I'd just go with LibreOffice. I almost did that with the used broken
computer my buddy gave me if I hadn't managed to dig out the product key
from the hard disk, or I would've installed my old Office 2003 Pro that
I got many many years ago for $40.
J
jan
Oh. I didn't realize that (as I had stopped reading the
outlook group).
thanks.
D
Danny D.
VanguardLH said:
Oh, you have no idea how much time I spent with Dell.
They did fedex my driver discs and the Windows operating system.
But, try as I might, they wouldn't do a thing for Office.
Let me ask the group at large:
Has *anyone* here really gotten MS Office from Dell as a backup disc?
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3803/9806260394_ccd715d344_o.gif
Note: See *my* story below:
< long story >
0. PC PURCHASE:
Last week, I bought, for about $500, a Dell Inspiron 15 from Costco. That
Costco Dell Inspiron 15 did *not* come with any hard media.
Both Windows 8 & Office Home & Student 2010 are on the hard drive.
The 25-character product keys for the OS & Office were *not* on the bottom
of the PC but were in a loose envelope in the box.
The 7-character Dell Service Tag & 10-character Express Service code were
on a sticker on the underside of the laptop.
1. SCAM SUPPORT:
Unfortunately, there was no Dell telephone number in the package. Googling
for "dell support telephone", 855-235-2101 was the first hit. Calling that
number (three or four times) was an exercise in futility. Only later, did
I learn that's a scam telephone number.
It's a fee-based support company called Albion Global Services.
They hang up on you as soon as they realize you're not going to fall for
their credit-card request. It took me a while to realize this.
3. DELL SUPPORT:
Finally, I found the "real" Dell telephone support number:
800-624-9896 (enter the express service code)
They were great! They are sending (some) of the disks:
a. Windows 8 b. DELL drivers c. But they do *not* send Microsoft Office
4. MICROSOFT OFFICE:
For Microsoft Office, they told me to download the disks from:
http://office.microsoft.com/backup
Here, you enter your 25-digit product key & can order disks ($13)
or download the installation files yourself.
5. DELL DRIVERS:
They also showed me where to download the DELL drivers myself:
http://support.dell.com Product Support->Dell Software Download
Center->OS & Drivers
6. REMOTE ASSISTANCE:
Since I was unfamiliar with Windows 8, they logged into my PC using their
GoToAssist program (http://dell.com/dc1).
a. They turned on Windows Defender as my anti-virus program b. They turned
on Windows Firewall c. They installed http://windows8.startbutton.com
SUMMARY:
Dell *will* send you the Windows installation disks, and the Dell drivers
and software disks; but only Microsoft will make Office 2010 available to
you as a disk ($12) or a free download.
< / long story >
J
JoeBro
VanguardLH said:
Good advice. There is also SoftMaker Office 2012
http://www.softmaker.com/english/ which is fully MS Office compatible for
about $100.
V
VanguardLH
Danny said:
What've I've got and what they supply with their hardware are the
recovery CDs. Their support is usually to send you the CDs (that you're
supposed to make yourself following their instructions) that restore
your computer back to factory-time setup. If they pre-install Microsoft
Office then it's in the image they restore.
Since your kid's hard disk crashed, restoring the factory-time image
onto the new hard disk is quick and gets you everything that came with
the computer.
Their level of support is what they bundled for a particular model.
They'll send you the restore CDs. There's a shipping fee, of course.
If your kid doesn't create the restore CDs himself then getting them
from Dell is a good idea for when the hard disk crashes again, his
system gets corrupted from malware or user error, or he somehow manages
to format the wrong partition.
Either there is a partition (a small one) holding the restoration
program. This may restore an image or perform the intial custom setup.
Or you are supposed to follow their instructions to create the restore
CDs yourself. You use their utility to create the restore CDs.
The pre-installed software is also pre-authorized. That eliminates
customers from having to perform the authorization after or during the
installation.
Not even "dell.com" was not listed anywhere on the packaging or in any
documentation? You never even thought of visiting their web site to
find their support pages and contacts?
Using Dell's web site for support has you enter their support tag ID.
That help focuses on what you bought from them rather than having to
ferret it out. They also list their contact telephone number on their
web site in their support pages.
Yep, lots of companies advertize themself as support for many products.
In fact, one reason you might switch away from Google as your online
search provider is that Google will knowingly sell ad-words to
competitors. For example, company-A and company-B are rivals so
company-B buys ad-words naming company-A from Google so users doing
Google searches click on company-B's ads in the search results thinking
they were going to company-A. Google doesn't care about this misleading
sale of ad-words. They just want the money.
So you're telling us about your mistake or Google's willful misleading
sponsor-ad search hits going to the wrong place but which has nothing to
do with Dell itself.
Because of Google selling their ad-words to competing companies and also
because their flagrant attempt to get you to change your home page to
them on every visit to their search site, I switching to Bing for online
searches. I still use Google for some searches, like for pictures,
because they seem to have a larger collection. If, for example, someone
wants to do something on their motherboard, I can find pics of it on
Google Images but not so many or not the right ones on Bing. Until
Google changes their evil ways for general searches, I don't use them.
Actually that would be something new as of Microsoft offering the backup
downloads. Before that, they wouldn't send you Office separately or
could even point you elsewhere. They would send you the restore CDs,
the same one you were supposed to make yourself.
In your case, you only wanted the install for Office. Dell doesn't have
that. They have their factory-time restore CDs. So you're lucky that
Microsoft later decided to provide backup downloads for their products.
However, since your kid's hard disk crashed, your kid will be needing
those restore CDs, anyway.
Of course, this presumes you can get online to visit their web site. If
the OS is dead on your computer, or you don't have network access
(because you only have 1 computer, the dead one, and need the mobo
chipset drivers that include network support), you either use the
restore CDs you created per their instructions or you have them ship you
the restore CDs.
So Dell's support is okay per your experience. Their support is to
restore your computer back to a working state. They know their setup is
okay but not anything you modified thereafter, so their support is to
get you back to the state of when you bought their computer. I'm sure
if they had bundled McAfee or Norton anti-virus suite then they also
wouldn't provide you a separate install of that and tell you to get it
from the software vendor. As an OEM, what they supply is their
customized configuration and that's what they support, not necessarily
pieces of it.
B
~BD~
jan said:
You are welcome, Jan!
In Message-ID: <[email protected]>
http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI=+<[email protected]>
Potty-mouth poster 'Aardvark' said "What the **** do you expect when you
ask impertinent questions to which the answers are none of your stupid
fucking business?"
Tell me .....
Do *YOU* consider my questions to be impertinent, Jan?
If so, I'd be grateful if you would explain why. TIA.