IMAP vs. POP

[kevs12]

Version: 2004
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger)
Processor: Power PC
Email Client: imap

I have four of my most important emails set up as imap

It's working ok, but I seem to notice every now and then an email, then come back later to read it and its gone missing.

It's seem with imap things "move" around by server and get misplaced every now and then. It seems less stable than pop.

What all think?

The benefits are killer: I can check email on laptop while an intern is hogging the desktop. I'm no longer locked out of my email that way, but this seems disturbing. Thanks!

 

[Corentin Cras-Méneur]

It's seem with imap things "move" around by server and get misplaced
every now and then. It seems less stable than pop.

Well with POP, everything gets downloaded to your computer, where you
can do the re-arranging, etc, so in essence, yes: it is less stable.
On the other hand, POP is impossible to work with (IMVHO) when you want
to access e-mails from more than one computer, so I wouldn't go back -
ever.

The problem can be:
- scripts/rules moving messages on one computer
- spam filters
- issues with the server itself (which I have seen before).

If everything is properly setup, beside point #3, you shouldn't run into
any problem (I don't)

Corentin

 

[kevs12]

Corentine,
a guy at my host company wrote this, what think??: agree?

email #1

The major problem with IMAP is also it's major benefit. It really only checks the messages on the server, it doesn't download them, which is great if you have multiple machines and don't need to download them to 4 different computers, or you have a phone and a computer checking the same account.
It's always best to have at least one email client set to download them as a POP account. IMAP simply reads what is on the server, so if you delete something, or move something through IMAP it's going to move that everywhere for every machine, so an accidental deletion deletes it everywhere, gone. So that's the big downside.
I believe that IMAP can be used really well if you are careful with it, but it's definitely not great as the only option on a machine. POP is great because it stores another copy of the message on your computer, and that's what you are working with, so mistakes are fixable, and the download is on your machine instead of the server keeping your space clean so mail can flow as fast as possible.
Hope this helps.

email #2

Yes, if you delete an email in IMAP technically it will go to the trash can, but you don't have control over how long it remains. Also, some peoples email applications like to move them to their local trash folders instead of the IMAP trash which will delete from the server and remove it from the server's trash. IMAP makes variables like this that are hard to track down.
You can have POP and IMAP in certain circumstances at one time. Let's say for example I have my Laptop and I have my iPhone. I check email on my laptop with POP and set it to keep a copy of the message on the server for 1 week. Then I have my iPhone set to IMAP. If I delete it from my iPhone the computer will not receive the message, but if I download to my computer and delete it, the iPhone will still see it, unless it's a week old in which case my laptop removes the message from the server.
So in many cases the combination is the best way to handle email on multiple devices. Always have a main machine running POP to backup and download email. Then you can use IMAP safely from other devices.

 

[Diane Ross]

Another option he did not cover is you can create a rule to copy a message
from IMAP to a folder "On My Computer".

I saw where you had 4 accounts setup. I would stick with those until you get
the hang of using IMAP before you start to add all your other accounts.

 

[kevs12]

I have hang up it. so we can now move onto this question-- what think of what he's saying Diane, to have both imap and pop together?

 

[Diane Ross]

I have hang up it. so we can now move onto this question-- what think of what
he's saying Diane, to have both imap and pop together?

It's a personal preference.

 

[Diane Ross]

See the thread "Moving messages from IMAP inbox to Local Folder". You might
find it useful.

 

[kevs12]

Diane,
Moving messages from IMAP inbox to Local Folder

did not come up on a search.

Also, once I do both Imap and Pop, not relevant. I'll just keep the Pops on local folder I want. the issue, is confusion that may arise, no?

 

[Diane Ross]

Also, once I do both Imap and Pop, not relevant. I'll just keep the Pops on
local folder I want. the issue, is confusion that may arise, no?

Considering the current state of confusion over this project I suspect more
confusion.

 

[kevs12]

Diane, this guy is super smart, what he says makes sense no? I'm playing devils advocate.

Here is his final email:

It is a bad idea to leave messages on the server for more than a week or so because it can fill up your server space for email and cause email to slow down, but 1 week doesn't hurt anything.
If you check with the G5 as POP and you download emails that computer would tell the server to delete in 1 weeks time. If you check on your laptop within that 1 week in IMAP they'll be there, otherwise they'll already be gone. If you check all day on your IMAP and not on the G5, when you download into the G5 they'll all download as unread, you just select them all and hit "read" and you're up to date on both machines.
Does that make sense? And in this scenario, let's just say all web servers get hit by an earthquake then a bolt of lightening and every email on the servers is deleted, if you were all IMAP you have 0 mail to your name from ever. If you have downloaded it via POP your G5 will have a copy of them all so you'd never be without those emails.

 

[Diane Ross]

Diane, this guy is super smart, what he says makes sense no? I'm playing
devils advocate.

There is no one right answer. A lot depends on what size allowance you have
on your servers. He advocates having backup in multiple places and I totally
agree, you can't have too many backups.

Select the options that work best for you and use them. If they don't work
as expected, then try other options.

 

[Terry R.]

The date and time was Friday, October 09, 2009 8:41:16 AM, and on a
whim, (e-mail address removed) pounded out on the keyboard:

Diane, this guy is super smart, what he says makes sense no? I'm
playing devils advocate.

Here is his final email:

It is a bad idea to leave messages on the server for more than a week
or so because it can fill up your server space for email and cause
email to slow down, but 1 week doesn't hurt anything. If you check
with the G5 as POP and you download emails that computer would tell
the server to delete in 1 weeks time. If you check on your laptop
within that 1 week in IMAP they'll be there, otherwise they'll
already be gone. If you check all day on your IMAP and not on the G5,
when you download into the G5 they'll all download as unread, you
just select them all and hit "read" and you're up to date on both
machines. Does that make sense? And in this scenario, let's just say
all web servers get hit by an earthquake then a bolt of lightening
and every email on the servers is deleted, if you were all IMAP you
have 0 mail to your name from ever. If you have downloaded it via POP
your G5 will have a copy of them all so you'd never be without those
emails.

And in that scenario, your G5 survives, but NONE of the web servers do,
nor any of their backups. Highly unlikely...


Terry R.

 

[kevs12]

The date and time was Friday, October 09, 2009 8:41:16 AM, and on a

whim, (e-mail address removed) pounded out on the keyboard:


And in that scenario, your G5 survives, but NONE of the web servers do,
nor any of their backups. Highly unlikely...


Terry R.

Terry,
I agree but what do you think of this? I do find Imap a bit unstable.

 

[Terry R.]

The date and time was Friday, October 09, 2009 6:46:03 PM, and on a
whim, (e-mail address removed) pounded out on the keyboard:

Terry,
I agree but what do you think of this? I do find Imap a bit unstable.

Unstable? How so? If you have it set up correctly, it's only as
unstable as the servers being used. If Gmail lost all their web
servers, their backups would have things back in place in no time.

I used mail clients and POP forever until about two months ago. I don't
have any need for them any longer. Setting up a mail client on every
workstation I wanted to access mail on was getting old.

Since I have moved all my email accounts over to Gmail, I can quickly
access everything wherever I have internet, even my phone. All accounts
on one screen, just like my mail client. I don't care to mess with a
mail client any longer. Of course I can access Gmail using my existing
mail client (Thunderbird), but why should I bother? I only use TB for
newsgroups now.

And using IMAP is much better than POP the way I'm using it, because I
can access all my folders, not just the Inbox. Like I said, I like IMAP
now because my phone has become my alternate "workstation".

If you feel the need to have your mail one a web server, and another
copy on your local workstation, fine. It's a personal preference. I
don't care about having local copies any longer. I don't store
everything in email as too many people do. I use it to communicate, not
store, and when my communication is done with that person, I delete it.
If there's a photo I want to save, I save it locally, then delete the
email. If I need to save a conversation, I'll do what is necessary to
preserve it.

And it's not a "bad idea" to leave mail on a server for more than a
week. I admin networks and users store years of crap on Exchange, and I
know users of webmail who never delete ANYTHING. Your friend has an
opinion, which in a perfect world would be nice, but he's not very
realistic.

You won't go wrong using IMAP or POP. Don't stress out about using the
"right" method, just use the one that works best for you.


Terry R.

 

[Diane Ross]

I do find Imap a bit unstable.

See if this article helps you. There are several links there to IMAP
providers.

Share one account with multiple users and/or computers

<http://tinyurl.com/9rpbdj>

 

[kevs12]

The date and time was Friday, October 09, 2009 6:46:03 PM, and on a

 

[Tim Murray]

let's just say all web servers get hit by an earthquake then a bolt of
lightening and every email on the servers is deleted, if you were all IMAP
you have 0 mail to your name from ever.

Great! I could then successfully use the saying, "sorry, I didn't get that
memo."

 

[Allen Matsumoto]

{Allen}:

I just switched most of my email accounts to use IMAP in Entourage so that I
can manage them from desktop or iPhone (read: if I delete 100+ messages
while working on my computer, I won't have to delete them all over again on
my iPhone as well, as I've been having to do with POP.)

I have a problem that seems to be an Entourage issue though:

When I am composing an email, I habitually hit Save from time to time to
avoid losing my thoughts in case of a crash. This is a habit formed across
all applications over 20 years of computer use, so alas, "don't do that"
won't be a workable solution.

In my IMAP accounts in Entourage, hitting Save results in the email closing,
being uploaded to the server, and then after a pause of anywhere from a few
seconds to several minutes, it eventually shows up in my Drafts folder. This
means that every time I unconsciously hit Save, I have to wait while the
message uploads, go to my Drafts folder, wait for it to show up, and re-open
it before I can keep writing. To say the least, this is a huge disruption
of workflow.

In Apple Mail, the message uploads in the background but doesn't close, so I
can keep writing. (There is some other quirky behavior with this in Mail,
but I won't go into it here.)

So my question is: Is there any way to force Entourage to leave the email
open while the Save uploads the new version to the server? If not, Entourage
may well be unusable for me as an IMAP client, which probably means either
back to POP and manually deleting hundreds of emails from my iphone (bummer)
or switching to Mail and losing all the Office integration advantages (big
bummer).

Thanks!

Allen

PS - Does anyone know how to set the Reply To address for newsgroup posts? I
don't like posting with my main address as the reply to, since it can result
in even more spam.

 

[Diane Ross]

When I am composing an email, I habitually hit Save from time to time to
avoid losing my thoughts in case of a crash. This is a habit formed across
all applications over 20 years of computer use, so alas, "don't do that"
won't be a workable solution.

The Save button should be named "Save as Draft". You can do a Command-S to
save to get the behavior you want. I suggest removing the button and teach
yourself to use the keyboard command. It won't take long to get in the
habit. I switched to a PC keyboard once and had to switch the Command and
Alt keys. I thought it would be an impossible task. The first day is the
worst.

PS - Does anyone know how to set the Reply To address for newsgroup posts? I
don't like posting with my main address as the reply to, since it can result
in even more spam.

Use a nospam account.

<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/get_started/tip019.html>

--
Diane Ross, Microsoft Mac MVP
Entourage Help Page <http://www.entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>
YouTalk <http://tinyurl.com/bzcrjy> <-- Entourage mailing list
Twitter: follow <http://twitter.com/entouragehelp>

 

[Allen Matsumoto]

The Save button should be named "Save as Draft". You can do a Command-S to

save to get the behavior you want.

Actually, Command-S is what I do (I should have stated that rather than say
that I "hit Save"), but even Command-S doesn't simply save the draft and
keep the window open as a POP email would.

Does everyone experience this behavior when saving drafts in their IMAP
accounts in Entourage?

1. Press Command-S to save the draft while working.
2. A progress window opens showing the draft being uploaded to the IMAP
server. It stays open until the draft is uploaded.
3. The message window closes so I can't keep writing.
4. I have to go to the Drafts folder, and force an update to have the draft
message downloaded from the server.
5. Then open the draft and resume writing.

In POP accounts, this doesn't happen, it just saves quickly and I can keep
writing.

I understand the difference between POP and IMAP, and that the IMAP draft
has to go up to the server. But what I don't understand is why Entourage
closes the draft and makes me go open a new copy of it that has come down
from the server. Apple Mail doesn't.

But for now, I'm just hoping that someone can speak to this behavior - is it
what happens to you?

Thanks,

Allen



{Allen}: