Installed from CD, apps in "trial" mode

[Clive Huggan]

It's truly unfortunate that big companies like MS have discovered that
there are people who will provide tech support for them for free.

More large software companies are discovering that setting up a
discussion forum alleviates them from spending money on real support.

There are the ones that actually staff the forum with employees.

I hate seeing you guys, who truly have more savvy than a lot of MS
employees, getting no real compensation.

A very kind thought, Kurt, but it isn't all that bad:

1. We all benefit from the questions, without which we would become stale
(and I'd be out the front; I have an appalling memory for some things).

2. We also benefit very much from each others' answers, and from newer
visitors to the newsgroup. (I think all of us benefit from spreading
cooperation and small kindnesses around the world.)

3. We only do as much answering as we feel like doing.

4. Quite apart from helping here, we have active professional lives, often
not in the IT industry (see some of us at
http://www.microsoft.com/mac/community/community.aspx?pid=mvp).

5. Microsoft couldn't afford the rates we charge in our "active
professional lives" -- Help Desk people are much cheaper to employ, and seem
to handle the everyday problems!

And I find Microsoft is actually good at facilitating the collaborative
efforts of people who receive a "Most valuable professional" award, and
provides some technical resources that are very useful. So in Microsoft's
case it's a two-way thing, I'm happy to say.

But still, it's nice of you to make the point. And as someone who has often
failed to get advice from Adobe and Apple equivalent to the advice you get
here, I certainly think that simply setting up a discussion forum saves them
heaps.

Cheers,

Clive Huggan
Canberra, Australia
(My time zone is 5-11 hours different from the US and Europe, so my
follow-on responses to those regions can be delayed)
============================================================
Avoid long delays before your post appears -- use Entourage or newsreader
software -- see http://word.mvps.org/Mac/AccessNewsgroups.html
============================================================

 

[Barry Wainwright [MVP]]

Just to clarify a detail in what Jim has said -- he stated that:

Using the Remove Office tool is destructive of the applications, but not
your data.--

Just be aware that if you have any custom templates stored in the
/Applications/Microsoft Office 2004/Templates/ folder they will also be
removed. Make sure you back these up (if you have any).


Barry Wainwright
Microsoft MVP (see http://mvp.support.microsoft.com for details)
The Entourage User's WebLog has moved!
For hints, tips and troubleshooting go to <http://www.barryw.net/weblog/>

 

[CyberTaz]

A very kind thought, Kurt, but it isn't all that bad:

1. We all benefit from the questions, without which we would become stale
(and I'd be out the front; I have an appalling memory for some things).

2. We also benefit very much from each others' answers, and from newer
visitors to the newsgroup. (I think all of us benefit from spreading
cooperation and small kindnesses around the world.)

3. We only do as much answering as we feel like doing.

4. Quite apart from helping here, we have active professional lives, often
not in the IT industry (see some of us at
http://www.microsoft.com/mac/community/community.aspx?pid=mvp).

5. Microsoft couldn't afford the rates we charge in our "active
professional lives" -- Help Desk people are much cheaper to employ, and seem
to handle the everyday problems!

And I find Microsoft is actually good at facilitating the collaborative
efforts of people who receive a "Most valuable professional" award, and
provides some technical resources that are very useful. So in Microsoft's
case it's a two-way thing, I'm happy to say.

But still, it's nice of you to make the point. And as someone who has often
failed to get advice from Adobe and Apple equivalent to the advice you get
here, I certainly think that simply setting up a discussion forum saves them
heaps.

Cheers,

Clive Huggan
Canberra, Australia
(My time zone is 5-11 hours different from the US and Europe, so my
follow-on responses to those regions can be delayed)
============================================================
Avoid long delays before your post appears -- use Entourage or newsreader
software -- see http://word.mvps.org/Mac/AccessNewsgroups.html
============================================================

I fully agree with every point Clive makes!!!! In fact, I'll go him a few
better

IMHO, I firmly believe that it is a *great* (rather than unfortunate) thing
that companies such as MS encourage & support these forums. When you take
into consideration that their products are in the hands of 10s of millions
of users it becomes evident that there is no way such an effective support
network could be staffed & maintained internally... It's logistically
impossible. Even if it could be done, the expense would have to be borne by
significant increase in the price of the product. I would much prefer to
avoid paying to support other users & have the company plow its revenue back
into product development.

Additionally, the forums provide a far more broad-based source of
information on the use of the software than any tech support line could hope
to provide. The typical scenario is dial a number, go through interminable
voice jail, ask a question, get escalated, *maybe* get a clear answer to
that specific issue from the one perspective & you're done... The next time
you call you can't get the same individual so the process starts all over
again... And you "hang on the line" for the whole session. Here you may have
to wait as long for a solution, but at least you can go about your business
& check back at your convenience - usually to find that there are several
meaningful replies to your post.

Clive's points #1 & #2 are especially on target. I've been using MS Office
programs since Gates was in diapers (metaphorically) as well as other
products that predate the birth of MS & _thought_ I was pretty savvy until I
started getting involved with the newsgroups a little over 2 years ago. In
those ~2 years I have come to *understand* more about how the software
actually works & how to use it *effectively* than I had been able to I the
previous 20 years. One of the main reasons for that is that in the NGs you
get the honest truth from experienced users rather than a "canned" solution
read from a support manifesto... I can't begin to tell you how much it
elevates my blood pressure to get some "wet-behind-the-ears" level 1 support
desk "tech" telling me that what I'm experiencing *can't happen*

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[Kurt]

I fully agree with every point Clive makes!!!! In fact, I'll go him a few
better

IMHO, I firmly believe that it is a *great* (rather than unfortunate) thing
that companies such as MS encourage & support these forums. When you take
into consideration that their products are in the hands of 10s of millions
of users it becomes evident that there is no way such an effective support
network could be staffed & maintained internally... It's logistically
impossible. Even if it could be done, the expense would have to be borne by
significant increase in the price of the product. I would much prefer to
avoid paying to support other users & have the company plow its revenue back
into product development.

Additionally, the forums provide a far more broad-based source of
information on the use of the software than any tech support line could hope
to provide. The typical scenario is dial a number, go through interminable
voice jail, ask a question, get escalated, *maybe* get a clear answer to
that specific issue from the one perspective & you're done... The next time
you call you can't get the same individual so the process starts all over
again... And you "hang on the line" for the whole session. Here you may have
to wait as long for a solution, but at least you can go about your business
& check back at your convenience - usually to find that there are several
meaningful replies to your post.

Clive's points #1 & #2 are especially on target. I've been using MS Office
programs since Gates was in diapers (metaphorically) as well as other
products that predate the birth of MS & _thought_ I was pretty savvy until I
started getting involved with the newsgroups a little over 2 years ago. In
those ~2 years I have come to *understand* more about how the software
actually works & how to use it *effectively* than I had been able to I the
previous 20 years. One of the main reasons for that is that in the NGs you
get the honest truth from experienced users rather than a "canned" solution
read from a support manifesto... I can't begin to tell you how much it
elevates my blood pressure to get some "wet-behind-the-ears" level 1 support
desk "tech" telling me that what I'm experiencing *can't happen*

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

They should at least throw you guys some stock options.

 

[JE McGimpsey]

Using the Remove Office tool is destructive of the applications, but not
your data.--

Just be aware that if you have any custom templates stored in the
/Applications/Microsoft Office 2004/Templates/ folder they will also be
removed. Make sure you back these up (if you have any).
[/QUOTE]

And further, put your templates in your Microsoft User Data folder,
where they won't be touched, and set the Project Gallery to find them
there.

 

[CyberTaz]

Actually, I had the "option" years ago at the IPO & blew it... Same for
another little "investment opportunity" by the name of Apple Computer %)

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac