Search Not Working

[Brian Mailman]

XP
FP 2002
http://www.jewishfood-list.com (bottom of Recipes page, link on left frame)

I keep receiving a "No Documents Found Error" even though I've:

1. Recalculated the hyperlinks
2. Removed and Reinstalled the extensions, twice
3. Cleared the temporary files and then recalculated the hyperlinks
3a. Renamed some files on my local web, recalcalculated the
hyperlinks, published up and then recalculated again.

Please don't tell me to contact the host and have them rebuild the
"catalogue." I'm with Interland and they claim there isn't one.

Thanks for any further suggestions!

B/

 

[Jim Buyens]

Please download the ASP or ASP.NET Self-Diagnosis page from:

http://www.interlacken.com/winnt/dnld/

add it to your site, publish it, run it, and report the three values listed
under Indexing Service.

Jim Buyens
Microsoft MVP
http://www.interlacken.com
Author of:
*----------------------------------------------------
|\---------------------------------------------------
|| Microsoft Windows SharePoint Services Inside Out
|| Microsoft Office FrontPage 2003 Inside Out
||---------------------------------------------------
|| Web Database Development Step by Step .NET Edition
|| Microsoft FrontPage Version 2002 Inside Out
|| Faster Smarter Beginning Programming
|| (All from Microsoft Press)
|/---------------------------------------------------
*----------------------------------------------------

 

[Brian Mailman]

Cool, thanks. Here 'tis:

Indexing Service
Indexing Service Installed The FrontPage Web Search component will, by
default, use Microsoft Indexing Service.

Indexing Service Startup Manual

NoIndexServer 1 The FrontPage Web Search component will use the
FrontPage search engine even if Indexing Service is present.

 

[Jim Buyens]

Well, Interland is correct: with these settings, neither Indexing Service nor
an Indexing Service catalog is involved.

Have you tried opening the remote site directly in FrontPage, and then either:
o Opening and saving your Web Search Page.
o Recalculating Hyperlinks.
o Both?

Jim Buyens
Microsoft MVP
http://www.interlacken.com
Author of:
*----------------------------------------------------
|\---------------------------------------------------
|| Microsoft Windows SharePoint Services Inside Out
|| Microsoft Office FrontPage 2003 Inside Out
||---------------------------------------------------
|| Web Database Development Step by Step .NET Edition
|| Microsoft FrontPage Version 2002 Inside Out
|| Faster Smarter Beginning Programming
|| (All from Microsoft Press)
|/---------------------------------------------------
*----------------------------------------------------

 

[Brian Mailman]

Well, goes to show you, even a stopped clock is right twice a day, but
don't get me started on Interland <G>.

Yes, I've recalculated the hyperlinks on the remote site, but not called
up the recipe index with the search component and resaved it.

Lemme do that now.... <play jeopardy theme>

OK, I've called up the page on the remote site, made a minor change in
the text and saved it. I also renamed some of the recipe files to force
new links and then recalculated them (and published back to my local
site so they'd be in sync).

No go

B/

 

[Jim Buyens]

Are the recipes in the same subweb as the search page?

Jim Buyens
Microsoft MVP
http://www.interlacken.com
Author of:
*----------------------------------------------------
|\---------------------------------------------------
|| Microsoft Windows SharePoint Services Inside Out
|| Microsoft Office FrontPage 2003 Inside Out
||---------------------------------------------------
|| Web Database Development Step by Step .NET Edition
|| Microsoft FrontPage Version 2002 Inside Out
|| Faster Smarter Beginning Programming
|| (All from Microsoft Press)
|/---------------------------------------------------
*----------------------------------------------------

 

[Brian Mailman]

Yes.

Nothing has been/was changed in terms of structure of the folders. The
search suddenly stopped working with that message. Usually it's the one
with the URL and "hash" in it, though and recalculating the links fixes
it. At most, reinstalling the exensions.

This time, neither action fixes it.

B/

 

[Jim Buyens]

This is beginning to sound like a size problem. Although I can't find a
specific reference, I'm pretty sure that the WAIS engine FrontPage uses in
the absence of Indexing Service fails if the number of indexed words exceeds
a certain value. You seem to have a lot of recipes out there so maybe...

The answer, in that case, would be moving to a server where Microsoft
Indexing Service was available. Typically, this costs only a few dollars a
month extra.

Jim Buyens
Microsoft MVP
http://www.interlacken.com
Author of:
*----------------------------------------------------
|\---------------------------------------------------
|| Microsoft Windows SharePoint Services Inside Out
|| Microsoft Office FrontPage 2003 Inside Out
||---------------------------------------------------
|| Web Database Development Step by Step .NET Edition
|| Microsoft FrontPage Version 2002 Inside Out
|| Faster Smarter Beginning Programming
|| (All from Microsoft Press)
|/---------------------------------------------------
*----------------------------------------------------

 

[Brian Mailman]

Erf. I've searched for "FrontPage AND WAIS AND size" but not found
anything

Sigh. What it needs is not an index server, but a databse.

Thanks for your efforts, though!! Greatly appreciated.

B/

 

[Gene]

Hello Jim,

We have the exact same problem as Brian. Our Search component suddenly
stopped working (see www.linguistsoftware.com/search.htm). We also use
Interland. The results reported by your Self-Diagnosis page (thank you!)
are:

Indexing Service - Installed - The FrontPage Web Search component will, by
default, use Microsoft Indexing Service.

Indexing Service Startup - Manual

NoIndexServer - 1 - The FrontPage Web Search component will use the
FrontPage search engine even if Indexing Service is present.

I have opened and resaved the search page and recalculated the hyperlinks
(several times).

Since it quit working around the same time as Brian Mailman's site, and
since both sites are on Interland, could there be something wrong with
Interland's server? Or is the problem size, as you suggest in a later
message?

If we pay Interland to move us to a server with Index Server available, what
will I need to do to make things work? Or is it automatic once the site is
published to the new server?

Thanks very much.

Sincerely,
Gene

 

[Jim Buyens]

Well if two sites stopped working at the same time, that might point to a
server problem, provided the two sites are on the same server and/or had
maintenance was applied at the same time.

After moving a site to a server where indexing service is supported, all you
normally have to do is open and save your search page directly on the hosted
server. If that doesn't do it, try recalculating hyperlinks. If that doesn't
do it, ask the host to verify that an Indexing Service "catalog" exists for
your site, then ask them to re-index it. (Re-indexing, BTW, is a very low
priority task and may take several hours to complete).

Jim Buyens
Microsoft MVP
http://www.interlacken.com
Author of:
*----------------------------------------------------
|\---------------------------------------------------
|| Microsoft Windows SharePoint Services Inside Out
|| Microsoft Office FrontPage 2003 Inside Out
||---------------------------------------------------
|| Web Database Development Step by Step .NET Edition
|| Microsoft FrontPage Version 2002 Inside Out
|| Faster Smarter Beginning Programming
|| (All from Microsoft Press)
|/---------------------------------------------------
*----------------------------------------------------

 

[Brian Mailman]

Wow, thanks, Gene for posting this. I had been going to call the
Business Office and ask about the Index Catalogue stuff (much faster,
easier, and incredibly much less painful than trying to talk to the
Interland "support" staff), but now I feel I guess I should call in to
the support folk and ask them.... unless you've already done so. In
which case, I'll pass you some of my blood pressure meds <G>....

Jim... aren't the hosting servers some kind of mainframe behemoths? Why
would it take hours?

B/

 

[Gene]

Follow-up to yesterday:

I just spoke with Interland. They sent me to http://answers.interland.com
and told me to look at article 15778, which says:

FrontPage Search Component no longer supported by Microsoft
Due to security issues, Microsoft is no longer supporting the FrontPage
Search component in their latest version of the FrontPage Server Extensions.
This latest version is currently running on blueHALO servers.

Unfortunately, Interland does not have any control over this action by
Microsoft.

Interland is currently looking into various solutions. In the mean time, if
you require a search feature, try searching the Internet for a comparable
component. One such Perl-based search tool is freely available off of the
Internet at http://www.risearch.org. Please note that Interland cannot offer
support for this or any other search tool.


We are not on a blueHALO server (at least I do not think our TrueBasic
account is on a blueHALO server), so I am not sure if this affects us. But
at least it suggests that the FP Search component is not going to work
anymore, and I have found out the Interland support people are not going to
help me get it working. I have not heard about MS no longer supporting the
Search component, so my next stop is the MS Knowledge Base.

I will also look at the www.risearch.org search tool mentioned above. It
costs $25 (after a 30-day trial). And I will look at Frontlook Site Search
Engine, which costs $39.95 (see http://www.frontlook.com/flsse/sse.asp).

Jim, thank you for your help, and your tips given below. Do you have any
other suggestions for another search tool for a very novice user? (I mean a
very, very novice user, who has never used ASP or PHP, or even CSS.)

Thanks,
Gene

 

[Gene]

Hello Jim,

You said, " After moving a site to a server where indexing service is
supported...."

Since the results of the Self-Diag ASP page (thanks again) report that
Indexing Service is installed but not working, is it possible all I need to
do is ask their support people to turn it on? Does not the report:

Indexing Service - Installed - The FrontPage Web Search component will, by
default, use Microsoft Indexing Service.
NoIndexServer - 1 - The FrontPage Web Search component will use the
FrontPage search engine even if Indexing Service is present.

just mean it is installed and available but not turned on?

If this is true, and all I need to do is ask Interland to activate it, then
after they do, I only need to follow your instructions below, right?

Thanks,
Gene

 

[Brian Mailman]

I'm on TrueBasic too. It's what Interland put me on when they borged
HostPro.

B/

 

[Gene]

Hello Brian and Jim,

I have some new information. I have searched the MS KB and can find no
information suggesting MS no longer supports the FrontPage Search component.
To the contrary, I have found several KB articles describing how to add
Search components to FrontPage webs. For example, see Microsoft KB article
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/assistance/HP011626971033.aspx, which
describes how to add a web search component to a FrontPage web site. This
method is the method I used to add the Search component to my web. It has
worked for many years, but suddenly stopped working.

Now see Microsoft KB article
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;828901, which
describes how to use the Search component with ASP pages. This article tells
why the Search component does not work with ASP pages. One of the solutions
given at the bottom of the article is to use regular .htm or .html pages
instead of .asp. Our FrontPage web site uses .htm pages, and not .asp.
Therefore, according to this Microsoft article, our Search component should
work.

Now see MS KB article
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/assistance/HP011650321033.aspx, which
describes how to add a Search page to a FrontPage web site.

Now see MS KB article
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/assistance/HP010337481033.aspx, which
lists the Components that may be added to a FrontPage web site. The web
search component is listed. If Microsoft no longer supported it, as
Interland says, then I would expect there to be a note here. In fact, if MS
no longer supports the Search component you would think there would be a
notice somewhere on the MS web site.

I have searched and searched the MS web site looking for any reference that
suggests MS no longer supports the Search component of FrontPage web sites.
I cannot find any article that suggests that MS no longer supports them. I
have written Interland (re-opened my support ticket) giving them all these
references, and have asked them to show me where Microsoft says they do not
support the Search component. I have also told them that on this newsgroup I
discovered another Interland customer whose FrontPage Search component
suddenly broke, as did mine. So they now know there are two of their
customers who were both using the Search component but whose search pages
recently stopped working.

Interland used to provide excellent support (we have been with them since
1997). Apparently they have outsourced their support. I could barely
understand the person with whom I was talking, and the "solution" was not
only unsatisfactory, it appears to be incorrect. Hopefully the information
from the MS web site will stir up some action from Interland. I will keep
you posted.

Regards,
Gene

 

[Thomas A. Rowe]

The default WAIS search engine is not longer supported under Windows 2003 Server (FP2002
extensions), only Index Server Search.

--
==============================================
Thomas A. Rowe (Microsoft MVP - FrontPage)
==============================================
If you feel your current issue is a results of installing
a Service Pack or security update, please contact
Microsoft Product Support Services:
http://support.microsoft.com
If the problem can be shown to have been caused by a
security update, then there is usually no charge for the call.
==============================================

 

[Brian Mailman]

Houston, we have ignition.

I spent some time y'day with support and while they don't have a
'catalogue' per se, they 'indexed' my site (seemed to take about 20
min;utes while they had me on hold) and the search IS working again.
They did tell me this feature was not available on all plans, but since
we're both TrueBasic, it might be worth a shot.

If they give you static, refer to ticket ##3503722.

B/

 

[Gene]

Hi Brian,

Thanks for the tip. They wrote me "closing" my case and telling me the
search now works. When I searched for "greek" it found 2 pages, instead of
the 73 pages it should find. So something still is wrong. I will call them
and ask them to "index" my site.

Thanks very much. (And thanks for the ticket number!)

Sincerely,
Gene

 

[Gene]

Hi Brian,

I received your message sent to my hotmail account, but could not respond
since the return address was invalid (apparently protected from spam).

I have not had time to call Interland; have been busy with other, bigger
problems. Hopefully, I can get to it in the next couple of days, and I will
report back.

Thanks,
Gene