Slow startup times

[nb]

Hi,

Every time I try to start up Word 08, I experience unusually slow
startup times. I have tried disabling fonts, etc., to no avail.

Interestingly, if I try to start up Word 08 on Leopard's guest
account, it starts up fast. I have isolated the problem to being
related to my login, but I have tried everything from deleting all
Microsoft preferences to deleting the normal files to disabling my
fonts. None of these measures have solved the problem of slow startup
times for Word.

When I launch Word, my activity monitor indicates that it is using
anywhere from 98 - 100% of my system resources. Many times this
triggers off loud fan noise from my Macbook. This lasts for 1-2
minutes and then Word finally launches.

Any suggestions?

 

[nb]

Also, I experience the same issue when launching PowerPoint. Excel
launches faster and without much of a problem, but it too takes up
100% of my system resources for a few seconds prior to launching.

 

[John McGhie]

Try turning off WYSIWYG fonts, and Show Project Gallery at Startup in
Word>Preferences>General.

Then quit and re-launch.

This works for a lot of people. Word 2008 launches quite snappily on this
MacBook. But it will struggle if you don't have enough memory: how much do
you have?

It will also struggle if you have a bad Normal template. To replace your
Normal.dotm, you need to hide not only Normal.dotm but all OLD versions of
the pre-2008 Normal template, which was called just "Normal". If you don't,
Word 2008 imports crud from the previous version template instead of
creating a clean one.

Hope this helps

Hi,

Every time I try to start up Word 08, I experience unusually slow
startup times. I have tried disabling fonts, etc., to no avail.

Interestingly, if I try to start up Word 08 on Leopard's guest
account, it starts up fast. I have isolated the problem to being
related to my login, but I have tried everything from deleting all
Microsoft preferences to deleting the normal files to disabling my
fonts. None of these measures have solved the problem of slow startup
times for Word.

When I launch Word, my activity monitor indicates that it is using
anywhere from 98 - 100% of my system resources. Many times this
triggers off loud fan noise from my Macbook. This lasts for 1-2
minutes and then Word finally launches.

Any suggestions?

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

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John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Nhulunbuy, Northern Territory, Australia
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[nb]

I have already turned WYSIWYG fonts off.
I have also turned Show Project Gallery at Startup off.
I have deleted any and all versions of the NORMAL or NORMAL.DOTM file

I am using a MacBook with 2 Ghz processor and 2 GB of memory and 160
GB of hard drive space.

I am pretty sure this is not a memory issue because I am getting very
good startup times on the guest account. The problem just seems to
happen within my user account...

Any other ideas?

 

[John McGhie]

Yup!

Hammer the Normal.dotm.

Drag it to the desktop, then go on a search and destroy mission for any
OTHER copies of Normal template on your system and drag those to the desktop
too. Note: the old versions of Normal template had no extension, they're
simply called "Normal".

You must ensure there are no other versions on the system, or Word 2008 will
try to suck in settings from them on first launch, and you will go round the
circle again.

Remove or rename ~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Word Settings (10)

(And ...Settings 11, if it's there).

Now, Launch and quit Word.

It should create a new clean Normal and everything ought to speed up.

Come back if that doesn't fix it.

I have already turned WYSIWYG fonts off.
I have also turned Show Project Gallery at Startup off.
I have deleted any and all versions of the NORMAL or NORMAL.DOTM file

I am using a MacBook with 2 Ghz processor and 2 GB of memory and 160
GB of hard drive space.

I am pretty sure this is not a memory issue because I am getting very
good startup times on the guest account. The problem just seems to
happen within my user account...

Any other ideas?

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Nhulunbuy, Northern Territory, Australia
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[MC]

Hammer the Normal.dotm.

Drag it to the desktop, then go on a search and destroy mission for any
OTHER copies of Normal template on your system and drag those to the desktop
too. Note: the old versions of Normal template had no extension, they're
simply called "Normal".

You must ensure there are no other versions on the system, or Word 2008 will
try to suck in settings from them on first launch, and you will go round the
circle again.

Can you safely save a *copy* of Normal under slightly different name? My
Normal hasa few odds and ends and attributes that took a while to get
the way I want them, and I don't relish the thought of having to
recreate it from scratch. Hence a clean copy, just in case I need to
replace the "real"Normal.

So is something like "Normal copy" kept in a folder other than
Applications going to screw things up?

 

[nb]

Hi John,

Thanks for the help so far. I tried deleting all version of the
Normal file as well as removing preferences as you indicated in your e-
mail. This didn't solve the problem, but I noticed something
interesting.

When I trash the normal file and empty the trash, Word takes about 17
seconds to launch. However, now if I quit Word and try to re-launch
it, it takes closer to 50 seconds to launch. This is after the
Normal.dotm file has been initially created. If I again trash the
Normal.dotm file, the launch time again comes down to 17 seconds.

But the problem is still there, because on my guest login, Word
launches in about 5 seconds.

Any other suggestions?

 

[Daiya Mitchell]

Can you safely save a *copy* of Normal under slightly different name? My
Normal hasa few odds and ends and attributes that took a while to get
the way I want them, and I don't relish the thought of having to
recreate it from scratch. Hence a clean copy, just in case I need to
replace the "real"Normal.

So is something like "Normal copy" kept in a folder other than
Applications going to screw things up?

No, but Normal isn't in Applications.

Also, John said drag it to the desktop, not delete it--just make it so
that Word doesn't find it. Renaming it as OldNormal is also fine.

You can recover your stuff from it later, see here
http://word.mvps.org/mac/MacWordNormal.html#Restore

 

[MC]

No, but Normal isn't in Applications.

SMACK -- the sound of one hand hitting my forehead...

Also, John said drag it to the desktop, not delete it--just make it so
that Word doesn't find it. Renaming it as OldNormal is also fine.

Good. Thanks.

 

[nb]

This problem is still unresolved.

Thanks.

Hi John,

Thanks for the help so far.  I tried deleting all version of the
Normal file as well as removing preferences as you indicated in your e-
mail.  This didn't solve the problem, but I noticed something
interesting.

When I trash the normal file and empty the trash, Word takes about 17
seconds to launch.  However, now if I quit Word and try to re-launch
it, it takes closer to 50 seconds to launch.  This is after the
Normal.dotm file has been initially created.  If I again trash the
Normal.dotm file, the launch time again comes down to 17 seconds.

But the problem is still there, because on my guest login, Word
launches in about 5 seconds.

Any other suggestions?

 

[John McGhie]

Gimme a BREAK!!! I have a day job, I only get in here once a day

Your problem appears to be that when Word 2008 re-launches, it is FINDING
another Normal or Normal.dotm template from SOMEWHERE and sucking it back
in.

The slow start-up is being caused by cruft in the Normal.dotm template. It
is LIKELY that there is an old copy hanging around in a folder "somewhere"
on your system that Word is finding and sucking rubbish out of.

That's why it's cured in your other User Login.

So I need to leave it to you to fin out where that stuff is coming from.

Sorry...

This problem is still unresolved.

Thanks.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Nhulunbuy, Northern Territory, Australia
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[nb]

Apologies... I mentioned that the issue was unresolved because there
were some other topics being discussed in this thread so I wanted to
make sure the last comment on the thread made it obvious that we still
had unresolved questions here... didn't mean to rush you!

Okay, I have used spotlight (forced it to search system and all other
files) to try to locate any other instances of a Normal file and there
are none. The only instance of normal that comes up is the
normal.dotm, which I have already written about in previous posts
(tried to delete it, Word takes 17 seconds to start when it's deleted
but takes closer to 50 seconds to launch when the file does not need
to be recreated).

I have also turned off the WYSIWYG font menu feature as well as the
gallery and I am trying to start Word on my own login vs. a guest
login and the launch time is disturbingly slow on my login only.

 

[Beth Rosengard]

Hi NB,

I'm trying to get my brain around this so let me restate what you said:
When you trash Normal.dotm and relaunch, Word takes 17 seconds to open; but
the *next* time you quit and relaunch, Word takes 50 seconds to open? If
that's correct, are you willing to try an experiment? It involves receiving
an attachment from me (*my* Normal template). I want to see what happens if
you try a Normal that's operating, er, normally on another machine

--
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Beth Rosengard
Mac MVP

Mac Word FAQ: <http://word.mvps.org/Mac/WordMacHome.html>
My Site: <http://www.bethrosengard.com>

 

[Phillip Jones]

You can even *hide* it in the Trash as long as you don't empty the trash
until your satisfied with everything first. You can always drag it back
out if you need to use it for something.

No, but Normal isn't in Applications.

Also, John said drag it to the desktop, not delete it--just make it so
that Word doesn't find it. Renaming it as OldNormal is also fine.

You can recover your stuff from it later, see here
http://word.mvps.org/mac/MacWordNormal.html#Restore

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[John McGhie]

Yeah, I knew what you were doing

We're all pretty highly-stressed in here currently. This has NOT been a
great product launch for us

If you try it with Beth's Normal.dotm, what happens?

This can ONLY be Normal template or Fonts. (It could be a bad Document
Parts.dotx, but that file came directly from the installer and is never
written to, it's either there and it's good, or it's not there, and it
doesn't matter.)

{Clutching at straws} You used the Remove Office tool to take out Office?
So it's not bad current preferences... Have a look to see if the following
file exists:

~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Word Settings (10)

Or:
~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Word Settings (9)

If they do exist, AND they are corrupted, the would normally cause a CRASH,
not slow progress.

I am sure you have also cleaned out your font caches. Even if you hadn't,
they would have cleaned themselves when you rebooted.

Sorry: I am outta ideas.

Try Beth's Normal.dotm

If it's not that, we'll ask Curt to take another look...

Cheers

Apologies... I mentioned that the issue was unresolved because there
were some other topics being discussed in this thread so I wanted to
make sure the last comment on the thread made it obvious that we still
had unresolved questions here... didn't mean to rush you!

Okay, I have used spotlight (forced it to search system and all other
files) to try to locate any other instances of a Normal file and there
are none. The only instance of normal that comes up is the
normal.dotm, which I have already written about in previous posts
(tried to delete it, Word takes 17 seconds to start when it's deleted
but takes closer to 50 seconds to launch when the file does not need
to be recreated).

I have also turned off the WYSIWYG font menu feature as well as the
gallery and I am trying to start Word on my own login vs. a guest
login and the launch time is disturbingly slow on my login only.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[John McGhie]

Hi Phillip:

Yes, we know. But I do not consider that to be "safe" advice for users who
do not know how to do that.

If they don't know how to do it, the file in the trash will remain in use.

Cheers

You can even *hide* it in the Trash as long as you don't empty the trash
until your satisfied with everything first. You can always drag it back
out if you need to use it for something.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]

 

[nb]

Hi Beth,

Sorry for the late reply to your post. You have understood my problem
correctly - 17 seconds when Word needs to create a new Normal template
and 50 seconds when the normal template is already created
previously. I would definitely like to try it out with your
normal.dotm to see what happens.

How would you want to send it to me?

Best,
NB

 

[nb]

Okay everyone, I have made some progress, although I am still not
there yet completely... here's an update:

First, I completely deleted my normal.dotm file.
Next, I went into my documents folder into the Microsoft User Data
folder and noticed that the one file I had in it was called "database"
and it was 86 MB. I guessed that maybe this had something to do with
my fonts.
I went into Font Book and disabled all my user fonts, while keeping
the computer fonts enabled.
Then, I deleted everything in my Microsoft User Data folder.

I re-started Word. It took the usual 17 seconds to start up, but I
expected this since it was creating a new normal.dotm.

Now I quit word and tried to re-start.
This time, re-start took about 15-17 seconds.

I quit Word several times and tried re-starting several times and each
time it took about 15 seconds to start up. I looked at the size of my
Microsoft User Data "database" file and it was now around 20 MB.

However, I thought that 15 seconds was still too much time to start
up. I went into my guest account and started up Word there. After
the initial startup time of 17 seconds, subsequent startups (after the
normal.dotm file was created) were nearly instant, with Word starting
up in 5 seconds.

I looked at the User Data folder in my guest account and noticed that
my "database" file there was also about 20 MB.

So now I am confused because my User Data file is the same size in
both my guest account and my own account, the Normal.dotm file, when
it does not exist, causes Word to take 17 seconds to initially start
up. But the confusing thing is that subsequent restarts take 5
seconds on the guest account and 15 seconds on my account.

Does this give you all any more insight?

 

[nb]

Per my previous post, if I re-enable my user fonts in Font Book, the
startup times for Word again increase to 50 seconds.

 

[John McGhie]

The User Database is your email file, if you are using Entourage.

If you are not using Entourage, it holds various other things that Office
would like to put in a database, such as contacts.

Office 2008 uses yet another new format for the database, and 20 MB is about
as small as it ever gets.

When Office applications start up, they first check to see if there are any
"new" fonts. If there are, they will rebuild the Office Font Cache. This
will take a bit of time.

Next time you restart the application, if nothing has changed, the font
cache will be up-to-date and Word will simply use it.

If you use a font manager that causes fonts to be enabled and disabled
frequently, you could expect to have to rebuild the Office font Cache every
startup. Ideally, you would settle on a font collection containing only the
fonts you actually use day-to-day, enable them, and leave them that way.

If you have several hundred fonts, and you make changes to the active set
dynamically, you can expect slow startup times

Personally, I believe this is a weak design. The system has a font cache
that it maintains automatically. I believe that Microsoft Office should
simply "use" the System Cache.

Hope this helps

Per my previous post, if I re-enable my user fonts in Font Book, the
startup times for Word again increase to 50 seconds.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:[email protected]